Calling all PG-free mixers!

Anyone with PG allergies ever try PEG400 and have it be OK? Not sure what the real difference is.

1 Like

Itā€™s a sensitivity not a allergy :wink:

Peg400 is for the other ā€œoilsā€ we donā€™t speak aboutā€¦here lol

It wonā€™t work with regular eliquid, as short answer.

However thereā€™s apparently a liquid out there, that steeps faster, gives higher flavor and can be used like pg, but isnā€™t pg. I think chemovatic sells it? I will look into it, only heard about it couple months ago and forgot all about it lol.

2 Likes

PDO is what I could find on the Chemnovatic site. Is this what you are referring to?

I remember ppl blaming PDO for flavor fade on the RFSC threads. This is 1,2 propanediol, and I think Walt was using 1,3 propanediol. Oddly, when I googled 1,2 peopanediol wikipedia says is another name for PG!

Hmmm.

2 Likes

I canā€™t remember but Iā€™ve it book marked at home. All I heard was, itā€™s not pg, it ā€œsteepsā€ your juices faster, sold in Europe and better flavor carrier.

Too me it sounded so stupid that I didnā€™t look further into it. You know like when someone says go on the roof your juice steeps faster, all you think off is : yeah right!

But Iā€™ll post the link tonight if I can find it. Sorry for not being much more help atm.

1 Like

That is funny! Iā€™d ignore that bit as well. An alternative to PG that works is of interest, though!

They say ā€œAllergy free: dedicated for people with allergies or sensitive to pertroleum-based substancesā€

umm, it always annoys me when things are marketed as ā€œallegen freeā€ cos thereā€™s no such thing . Whatever the substance , you can probably find somebody somewhere in the world whoā€™s allergic to it! That said, , Iā€™ve nothing against this partuicular manafacturer, on that count. They all do it!

More annoyingly, the stuff is made out of unspecified ā€œvegetablesā€, as they very clearly and e4xplicitly assume that PG senstivity is due to the petrochemical origin. So who would care what vegetables they use, eh?

Good grief! That is one huge- and quite possibly false- assumption.

This post triggered a little burst of research on my part into how these various PG -related sunstances are made (so thanks for that!) And I fouund out that, increasingly often they are made from cornā€¦and that includes PG itself! You certainly canā€™t assume a pertrochemical origin for PG. And that might be the real problem

I found speculation from some PG-allergy sufferers who happened to also be sensitive to corn that these two . seeminly different sensitivities are just two faces of the same thing, at least in their case. That gives me pause for thought Iā€™m also sensitive to both PG and corn. And Iā€™m wondering how many others ? Corn sensitivity is pretty damned hard to uncover, because corn is added to almost every damned thing, and doesnā€™tt always appear on the label. You might pick up on the fact that youā€™re having bad reactions to a whole host of processed foods, cosmetics, medicines etc, but tracking down the culprit is insanely difficult, especially if youā€™ve never even heard of corn sensitivity. (which is the exact boat I was in, a few years back , when my corn troubles started)

Iā€™m now wndering if I can safely vape PG which actually does come from petrochemical sources? But who the heck ever tells you what theyā€™ve made their PG out of? Thatā€™s a million miles from being a labelling requirement. So Iā€™ll just have to go on wonderng, I guess .

2 Likes

I would think the official scientific explanation would tell us that 1-2 propandiol (which is PG) is that chemical and nothing more regardless of the source material the end result, chemically speaking, is the same. I do not trust science or the FDA however :laughing:

2 Likes

Agreed :slight_smile: thereā€™s always something that ā€œscienceā€ never thought to take into account . And when most research ā€œscientistsā€ are in the pay of Big Industry , you can multiply that factor one hundredfold *sigh *. One way or another, they just get the results they want, donā€™t they?

2 Likes

The chemical is the ā€œsameā€ (PG and PDO) but the molecular structure is ā€œrotatedā€. Same is true of Starch and Cellulose ā€¦exactly the same ā€œchemicallyā€ but the glucose molecules are alternately rotated in Cellulose. The difference is one is PAPER (cellulose) and one is food (starch). Termites can eat wood (cellulose) because they have a bacteria in their gut that can break the bonds of cellulose making it digestible as glucose ā€¦most other animals cannot (Ruminants can).

2 Likes

I believe you misread or misinterpreted my sentences, good sir. I stated that PG whether derived from petroleum based sources or vegetable the end result is still chemically speaking still just PG. PDO is indeed a different animalā€¦

1 Like

Apologies my friend, that was not intended as a correction, just an attempt to clarify overall. I tried PDO for a YEAR and I count it as lost time ā€¦but then I donā€™t have a PG sensitivity. I was just looking for a better ā€œcarrierā€ flavorwise, and it was not. The ā€œfadeā€ thingy was real. It seemed better at first (SnV) but usually ended out weirder over time. It wasnā€™t bad ā€¦it just wasnā€™t better. It became unpredictable (steeped Custard flavorwise) ā€¦and expensive, but I wasnā€™t looking for a solution to my PG sensitivity. It might be a solution for that (because the molecule is rotated), but I have zero insight there. Bro Hugs

2 Likes

All good, wanted to clarifying my opinionā€¦ Yes i heard PDO was responsible for flavor fade and it was speculated that was a problem with RF SC flaves. Whether it was PDO to blame or simple overflavoring is still up for debate as peoples percentages where all over the map. I have considered Trying PEG(not food safe though correct?) And or PGA and would like to experiment with 0.5-1% DW as wellā€¦

1 Like

RF was putting out flavors with PDO instead of PG before they offered the current SC line

Is that what was in the ā€œextractsā€ then?

Edit: lmao i remember now they were having people test out PDO flaves, before the extracts, then followed the SCā€¦

1 Like