DIY Flavor strength vs commercial juices

E-liquids Beginners
22

There is nothing at all wrong with low heat - I will however say that in my opinion & expirence high heat does absolutely damage a mix (i have left the hot plate on when i got distracted). Somewhere along the line heat damage has been has been equated to any heat. Higher temps have also been linked to nicotine potency reductions.

I don’t think it is contentious I just think that some people read high heat and equate it to any heat and some people prefer not to heat at all - everybody finds their own groove with mixing and at the end of the day should do what works for them in their situation.

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23

If your hotplate stirrer is anything like mine it will heat to very high temp in a very short time. Mine will boil water faster than my stove. So I didn’t say that flavoring can’t be damaged, only that heat in the ranges I have stated won’t. As sparkslfly said there is a noticeable advantage. But I agree people should do what works for them. However I have a problem with new people trying to learn being told nonsense when they ask for help.

As far as nicotine degradation, I don’t know. I add it after mixing and cooling. But I’m not worried about the heat, I don’t want to oxidize it.

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24

Yes I was agreeing with you - was just saying that high heat is not good.

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25

I started typing before you added the story.:rofl: I guess i should look before I pull the trigger. My bad. :upside_down_face:

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26

I occasionally get to talk to guy that is in charge of formulating recipes for an ejuice company. They have probably a dozen lines of their own, and they mix, bottle and label for other ejuice brands. He told me that some of the commercial ejuices are up to 39% flavorings. I think that will explain why some brand name juice seems so strong.

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27

Hardware is not the problem. I also use smok coils most of the time. There is no room for mistakes when Im running the same hardware all the time.

What I can extract from the replies is that I have not shaken the liquid good enough.
So what I am considering is:
· Ultrasound cleaner
· Rotatory wheel

What do you think about rotating the bottles during long hours or even nights?
Will this be enough?
Cheers

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28

There are a lot of people here that use US cleaners. and lots of others that claim they shouldn’t to this. Do a search. But in any case mine gets used all the time for cleaning tanks and other vaping related items etc, so even if you try that method…which I believe works very well… and feel it doesn’t work for you you would still have a very useful device.

I know nothing regarding the rotary wheel. zilch.

The point I want to make and as the FA rep advised, is that even with high tech devices such as the high shear devices, there is a time factor. Call it “steeping” evaporation, off gassing, or whatever, ejuices develop over time. I’ve read that high shear homogenization eliminates 60 to 80 % of the “steep” time which would be very useful for production purposes. But I have no need for that and am a simple DIY mixer. The other aspect is achieving a homogeneous mixture which can be achieved by a variety of ways.

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29

I use mine as a part of routine. 1/2 hr in the mag stirrer and 1/2 hr in the usc. No heat applied at any time. Comes out “warm”. I have not bothered to take it’s temperature. Out of the magnetic stirrer the juice is semi, maybe pseudo frothed. After the usc it is clear of aerobic gassing visually. As a matter of process I stick to this routine for evaluation of juices. Obviously a “works for me” application with the premise of “if it’s not broken, don’t fix it”.

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30

I’m really curious and am not trying to tell you to change or do anything. But why the concern about heat when you’re dealing with chemicals used for cooking, baking, and especially candy making?

I’m also curious as to “pseudo frothing” ?? Is the forced introduction of oxygen into a mixture harmful or beneficial?

Under the ultrasonic process are you sure that a large amount of heat is not being applied? For example, I read an article about one of the drawbacks to using a commercial ultrasonic homogenizer is the heat produced which in turn required a solution to be packed in dry ice to prevent heat damage. With that type of unit the us probe is inserted directly into the solution.

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31

Lol, Telling me to change would most likely be futile. There really is no great concern about heat. My mag stirrer is not heated, so that’s non sequitur. I have read so many debates no on heat vs no heat that I figure I’ll just save money in the electric bill at this point. In regard the the degree of aerobic interaction between chemicals, I had a pretty good handle on the process regarding microbial growth in the day but I have nothing definitive in mind to judge degree in e-juice mixing. The use of the terms “semi” and “pseudo” were an attempt to describe the appearance of the juice after mixing not an attempt to qualify degree of aerobic presence. Again, I’ve read so many debates that I have no idea how many bubbles per cubic CM is optimal. Yes that is a little tongue in cheek but I’m sure you get my drift.

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32

Ditto to dat!

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33

@DavidMiranda somethink that i just remembered. It was a period that I was DIY my juice and a friend was buy commercial. When I try his eliquid I was wondering why it taste with more strenght… but he has the same question for my eliquid. :wink:

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34

Whether I do or not is irrelevant. The question is whether new mixers having problems and seeking solutions will. I think not. Their questions almost variably begin with declarations that they are doing everything “right” which includes this prohibition on the use of heat and many declare how they have whipped everything into a beneficial froth. Hmmm, but they are dissatisfied.

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35

You make a lot of assumptions as you are entitled.

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36

@SmilingOgre & @TorturedZen

There’s an easier way (so you don’t end up doing a “filler post”) FYI: at the end of every thread (easier to find when it’s new) there is a button that says “normal” when it’s not being tracked.

You have a couple of options to pick one you click on it. “Tracking” and “Watching” will accomplish what you’re after (though each handles it slightly differently).

FWIW, the same button, is also what facilitates you to ignore a thread, and never have to see it again! So while that may be useful as well, be careful when making your tracking or watching selection, as you may end up losing the very thread you were interested in should you misclick!

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37

I have a question and I think your input would be valuable. When I first started posting about stirrers I mentioned that I was building a device using a small 12 V DC 1000 RPM gear motor. It incorporated a lid and sealed bearing along with a stirring shaft. I did not elaborate much and instead posted a pic of a canning jar with the assembly and stirring shaft. If I remember correctly you saw this.

While it was my intent all along to build this where it could be used anywhere, stand alone, on a hotplate, or with bottles resting in a Crockpot or ultrasonic cleaner. I did not know that you used a us cleaner.

With the combination of us and simultaneous stirring, what do you think of such a device. I should add that at this point its a fail. The junky ass cheap motor puked within 8 hours of use after waiting damned near a month to get it.:joy:

As you know I have loads of equipment so it was not going to benefit me in the slightest. A simple PWM speed control was used, and safety the primary consideration.
It fits in a small project box and was tiny and cheap to DIY.

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38

Was there not a recipe posted on here that was a discontinued juice from the company and folks couldn’t believe the high % of some flavourings?

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39

I definitely recall the idea, as well as the picture posted. :slight_smile: And I found the idea interesting and was planning on following how it played out (should it be pursued, and come to full fruition).

Honestly, while I’m always interested in new ideas, methodologies, and advancements to user conveniences… I can’t personally see any benefit that additional stirring could provide, when the cavitation process of the ultrasonic waves is already doing the work at a “molecular level” (slamming the PG/VG/flavoring/nic into each other at the speed of sound literally).

Additionally, I would posit that the stirring device (assumed mounted in a center position) would only interrupt/conflict with, the pattern being generated by the US waves. As the transducer in most US units is mounted in the center, under the bottom of the pan. IE: mine is is smaller, square unit (holds about 9 30ml bottles, which I submerse to the top of the neck, without touching the cap) and the wave pattern that is generated travels from dead center to within about a half inch of the walls (when empty). When loaded with bottles, that pattern is somewhat affected (naturally) but I tend to arrange things in a geometric pattern, and they’re not usually far off from that when I return (anywhere from 1 hour later - fruits-, to two or three hours later - custards/creams-). The only times I typically see things being unlike I left them, is if I overload it with 15ml bottles. (TLDR: the waves are minimally affected, unless I “violate” the capabilities of the machine)

At any rate, the waves pass through glass like it wasn’t there. Not the case with plastics (as we know), which is why an ultrasonic isn’t recommended to folks who don’t use glass, as the process is greatly diminished. Obviously it’s not going to do so (waves pass through) a metal rod that’s rotating. That’s a point of disruption.

In my mind, unless the stirring device was timed (in mathematical precision) with the generated waves, I would be surprised to learn that the process would be helped. As I would expect the opposite to occur.
Perhaps the stirring offsets the loss of some waves effects?! Hard to say!

But it’s all a fart in the wind without testing to back it up! :wink: So I’ll be happy to watch your progress, and read your thoughts and observations, as things continue to unfold! :thumbsup:

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40

Definitely sorry to hear that.

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41

Are the molecules being agitated at the speed of sound or the frequency of the USC which is generally between 35 and 40khz?

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