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Oh der, I missed that. Thx
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Maybe theyâre adding some other ingredient to make it more of specialized or niche custard. If it isnât better than Premium then whatâs the point?
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While nobody knows the long term effects of vaping diketones they do permanently scar human lung tissue at itâs not reversible itâs permanent lung tissue scarring . That is a known fact and has been for over a decade. It should be noted that since scarring of lung tissue isnât proven to result in long term complications since vapingâs still relatively new each individual has the choice to decide for themselves .
Anybody that attempts to tell you that vaping diketone containing flavors/juices doesnât cause irreversible lung scarring is being blatantly dishonest .
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That sounds interesting , Iâd love to hear more.
Are there newer studies in the meantime?
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@hbbb welcome to ELR, not an easy debate this one⊠But first of all, Diacetyl is not (or shouldnât) used anymore in liquids or flavourings, firms like FA or FLV, and most of the ones we use for mix DO NOT contain diacetyl since 2015/2016 if I remember correctly
FA states quit clearly when a flavour contains Diketones and states that is not suitable for vaping when it does.
When an FA flavour contains diketones itâs for the kitchen line, not the vaping line. e.g. in Italy we canât have their Premium Custard in a vape shop.
But even if a flavour could contain Diacetyl the percentage in which that compound is used is minimal, typically 1 to 5% (and itâs an high percentage) so that 1% gets further diluted into a mix at an even lower percentage, letâs say 2 or 3% not very good on math, but the end the result is really low, also think that probably that liquid is not used in a long period.
We have to consider that the aim is Harm reduction from smoking and while weâre not breathing âFresh Airâ we have to consider that Diketones in vaping are 750 times lower then smoking.
https://tobaccoanalysis.blogspot.com/2015/12/new-study-finds-that-average-diacetyl.html
So the most important thing is knowing when a flavour contains Diacetyl and be able to decide whether to use it or not, on a shelf bought e-juice we donât know if it does or not!
We have to know what we are doing (Most of us here at ELR know what weâre doing and what weâre using) itâs thank to the mixing community that warnings like this are known, check the calculator or sites like DIY Flavour Safety.
Browse Flavors | DIY Flavor Safety (diyejuice.org)
Here nobody does, we are the first to look and analyze safety, and probably somebody forgot to tell smokers that thenâŠ
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Ignoring, for a moment, the fact that Iâve never read the first statement below, here on ELR or elsewhereâŠ
And anyone who attempts to peddle unfounded, and unsubstantiated proof of these claimed effects, as it applies to vaping, is blatantly perpetuating and supporting fear-mongering.
So youâre pulling out an unrelated âfactâ and applying it to the current subject when thereâs no other correlation than the word diketone??
Seeing as how there was practically zero vaping-related testing 10 years ago, what makes you think the same findings from another situation, form of the chemical (betting your point of reference is a powder, which wouldnât be handled the same by the body), much less differences in concentration levels, etc.
ânobody knows the long term effects of vaping diketonesâ after allâŠ
Whole milk is not skim milk, itâs not 2%, is not almond milk, is not goatâs milk, is not⊠But theyâre all âmilkâ after all, so theyâve got to have the same effect right? 
Iâve got a friend Iâd like you to meet: his name is Paranoid Parrot 
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If Papaya Indian Special is anything like their Mango Indian Special, Iâm going to loooove it. Thatâs some tasty mango goodness. For now, WF Papaya is the best IMO.
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Got my sample pack in today, massive thanks to FlavourArt for giving me the opportunity to test these flavors 
I did try a few and did also make 1 mix that needs steep 
In case anyone want to follow the progress of creating my flavor notes, they can be accessed here:
My plan was to start on 1 new flavor each day from the middle of the week that we are about to enter, but since i already decided to dig into it, i might as well continue from now on.
I will be testing them at day 0, 3, 10, 20 and 30.
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Iâm willing to bet you canât point to one study that provides evidence to your claim. Not a study that uses conjecture or correlation, but one that has evidence and has been peer reviewed and published. You canât do it, I know and you know it, so you have to resort to linguistic tactics such as âThat is a known factâ and âblatantly dishonestâ. In the first you make the claim that everyone should know this, or at least have easy access to this claim. In the second you attack the character of anyone that would dare challenge your claim and set yourself up as being morally superior to those who do so.
In my opinion, whether you can provide evidence notwithstanding, youâre just another asshole in an ever widening circle of assholes in this country. You want to feel morally superior because itâs makes you feel better. If you want to feel superior than others, then do it on a merit based thing, not on your weak and sophomoric attempts to degrade others who disagree with you.
I tend to let things go, but as time goes on, Iâve had it with the raging idiots. It used to be that the average person only had to deal with their one idiotic friend and their weird uncle at the holidays. But with the advent of the internet every asshole in the world can now spew their idiocy and venom onto the public. Iâm tired of all you unthinking, morally deficient and cowardly pussies.
Have a nice day.
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I would consider addressing your statement but as you are repeatedly contradicting yourself - It is hard to see, or find, the point.
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A couple of us have inquired about this but you havenât replied yet. I suppose my first question would be, who is âweâ? I vape NETs and am interested to know more.
To my knowledge, homogenizing is a blending process and extraction is a separation process. How is this accomplished with a homogenizer? Please, do tell. If youâre referring to a hydraulic high pressure homogenizer, that wouldnât be available to the average vaper anyway. Need more info, please, thank you.
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Umm itâs not relatively new. Next time copy an article thatâs more recent.
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Sorry @muth about not answering before, I intended âweâ as a team, the H&V Team (check YT).
I am/was/is the technical/theoretical part, Fabiano is an engineer and tech office manager.
It all started when we wanted to make an all in one homogenizer, rather than just the probe.
When we designed it we wanted more and went for a 24000 rpm motor,(and all related problems we had to solve) Iâve found out that with that speed and tolerances (talking microns here) we start a cavitation process, my little brain started thinking about hydrodynamic cavitation extraction.
Iâm not an expert on NETs (but am on tobaccos) thatâs where Giorgio comes in, heâs an expert on tobaccos always did NETs with ultrasonic extraction and has a 7 years experience ithatâs why I pulled him in, so we could compare the two products, I needed him to push further the brainstorming.
I think that with the right process you can also do it with a GC, speed and tolerances should be allright, we are working on a video that explains and shows the whole process, starting from the tobacco ending with filtration with micronized talc and logically, homogenization, but not always something you want though, e.g. Latakia gets sweet after steep or homogenization.
First shred and mince the tobacco, put it in PG with a 1:5 ratio, 10g of tobacco 50ml of PG, use the homogenizer to do the extraction, checking that the temperature doesnât go too high, we then filter it with a 25 microns filter, after that put a teaspoon of micronized talc, to take resins, oils, sugars and nasty things out and do a second pass filtering with a 5 micron filter.
Anyway, it works perfectly and itâs comparable if not better (we loose less volatiles) than the ultrasonic extraction
Itâs not something I suggest people to do, itâs potentially dangerous, this unless you know exactly what you are extracting,e.g. not a packet of cigarettes!! If you can vape it, if you know how to do it, everything has to be perfectly sanitized,
You can see our channel on YT: H&V Team - lâautosufficienza nello svapo - YouTube
Our first test if homogenizing works was a hard oneVG and oil⊠and it workedâŠ
at today that mix is still stable!!
Omogeneizzatore FFv1 - YouTube
Here different tests, and some of them already have extracted tobaccos (you can tell by the colorâŠ) H&V - YouTube
Now weâre working on a Mesh/Cotton atomizer⊠checking the air flow using a 3D CFD software and keeping in mind the Coanda effectâŠ
itâll never endâŠ
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Fantastic. I confess that I was responding in a private message about what I thought you were doing. However, I made clear that I know nothing about extractions and the processes. Great info.
I have a 30mm Kinnematica with knife blades on the rotor. I will have a better look at your website but assume that this device would be suitable to use with your method?
This thing is pretty scary turning 25 K rpm. 
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Thank you, Frank. Your answer was exemplary and the product looks fantastic. Thx for the links and I wish you much success.
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Itâs only a matter of trying, you wonât need all of 25K, weâve found that 80% of the 24K is more then enough to start the cavitation and do the extraction.
What for? the project is open source,available to everybody, the same will go for the atomizer,itâll be under common creative, weâll have it produced and weâll send it, but once we covered the sheer costs, we ask for a donation for a childrenâs hospital, not for us, we all work (well Iâm retired) and have a good wage⊠itâs just for the satisfaction of making things work as we want them to, reallyâŠ
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I havenât reuped anything in a long time, nor finished testing the ânewâ stack and here you are teasing us with new flaves! Lol I am more than interested in a few of these , please post thoughts and SF testing results when you canâŠ
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I will do that, donât worry!
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