Evening all, new here. I’m fairly new to Vaping and Mixing also.
I’ve been using this website for a few months trying to put together a couple single flavour recipes to get the hang of liquid mixing and to slowly introduce myself to common ingredients used for certain flavour effects. I am however having a few issues.
Hardware
First off, as I’m a nublet, I’ll start with hardware.
100w iQbox with 0.2 (55-75) Cleito
Limited Edition 100w Coolfire IV with 0.2 (55-75) Cleito
I tend to vape at around 45w and prefer sweeter flavours; particularly Element Emulsion range. Keylime Cookie and Frost… mmmmmmm.
Troubles
So I started out by purchasing a mixing kit. I have 500ml of PG and VG and got 6 flavours that I thought I’d like. They included Skittles, Tutti Fruiti, Rainbow Sherbet, Cola, Cherry Cola and Bubblegum. I’ve followed a few single flavour recipes using these flavours a few times and each and every time they taste like shit. I have steeped the liquids well, longer than intended in fact because I avoid using the vile shite.
It seems my flavours are either non-existent or extremely weak, or have a shitty taste to them. Almost like a perfume. I’ve looked around and it seems I’m not the only one. I’ve been using Cola and started out with small flavour amounts and increasing by 0.2ml each time I try and every time it’s either tasteless, or shit.
I originally suspected the VG but I have borrowed some VG from a friend in a local Vape shop and it’s the same thing. The smell of the liquid is great every time though.
Questions
What is the primary cause of this perfume like taste?
I love sweet flavours. I’ve seen sucralose mentioned a few times during research. Recommendations?
Is there a recommended, flavoursome recipe you would recommend starting out with?
If in the UK which store is best to purchase from (Quality/Price)
I have some Flavour West Cola left, it’s vile. What should I add to make it less awful? I feel like I am wasting a good 9mil of the stuff just sitting there.
Throw in any other info you think would benifit me (I am currently working my way down the beginner guide already.)
Honestly i dont recommend buying kits but at least your got the other supplies with it. What i would do is check out some of the top rated recipes on the recipe site and see if any appeal to you. Keep in mind that just because they are top rated doesnt mean they will be fantastic to everyone and there are a LOT of great recipes that dont have lots of ratings.
With that in mind, if you find something that looks yummy order those flavors. One of my favorite sweet mixes is Sugar Rush by ThirdWorldOrder. It is creamy, sweet and sinnamony delicious!
@Lord_Dan
I have a couple questions and then some suggestions for you
What brands of flavor are available to you?
2 Ratio of PG/VG are you mixing at?
What percentage of flavoring are you adding to you mix?
How are you steeping them and where.
Note: Steeping times for me are
Fruity vapes Minimum 7 days preferably 14
Fruit vapes and booze flavor in them minimum 10 days preferably 21
Creamy vapes with or without fruit booze or what ever
minimum 14 days preferably 28 days
Most generally when I get a flavor I like I make 100 to 240 ml and say bye bye to it for a month. It makes all the difference in the world
Now some suggestions. When doing fruit flavors I always add a touch of Sweet (either cotton candy (ethyl maltol) or marshmallow flavor). All of my sweet fruit flavored vapes have a tiny bit of The Flavor Apprentice sour. Adding both sweet and sour sort of cancel each other out but doing so brings out the flavors and makes them pop. When you steep do it in a cabinet where your juices are in the dark. Personally I leave the cap loose for the first few days and two or three times a day I will pick up the bottle and give it a squeeze to put all the air out of the bottle. Then I put my finger over the top and shake the heck out of it. squeeze the air out again only this time do in under your nose and smell the juice. After a week I’ll vape a little and see where it is. I as a rule don’t mix single flavor vapes and the ones I do make run from 18% to 25% flavorings in them I vape at 3MG nic and my ratio is 75VG/25PG. PG Doesn’t like me very much If I vape higher I feel like I’ve got a bull on my chest.
The flavor companies I like best are The Flavor Apprentice, Capellas, Flavor Art, and recently Flavorah.
Try some FlavourArt, Flavorah and Inawera flavours, they are more concentrated than FW, CAP and TPA. It’s always good to have some different brands to mix with. FW, CAP and TPA have some really good flavours, like Vanilla Custard v1 by CAP for instance. Marshmallow is often used as a sweetener too. I can’t really help you in the sweet flavour department since I’m a tobacco nut but I can give you my 2 cents anyway
You can also check notes other people made about flavours to get you some idea of how well they are generally liked. :: Flavor list e-Liquid Calculator
I cannot really tell you, maybe the flavours you got with the kit were just shit to start with. I’ve bought a kit when I just started out (haven’t we all ) and they’re usually not the best flavours.
Well anyway, welcome to the rabbit hole called DIY and the nicest forum on the planet. I’m sure you will get lots of help and suggestions from the great peeps here and I’m sure your head will spin but don’t worry, you’ll soon be giving out advice yourself, trust me, I was a noob not so long ago
Almost every flavor you have in your stash is a very fruity perfumey one…sorry but true. Like @Ken_O_Where said try to avoid the kits as they’re not as helpful as you think. Start gathering your resources for your local supplier. What part of the UK are you in ? @Pattie may be able to point you to some trustworthy suppliers .
How do you mix , meaning what method …do you use syringes or weight scale ? I recommend you get a scale and start mixing by weight if you are not already.
Getting to know which flavors you like overall is probably the toughest part time & money spent but truth is it is a trial and error situation.
I have learned if it smells floral- perfumey off the bottle it does not always mean it taste that a way. I stick to what suits me for all of my SB mixes I heat them in a warm bath ( I use a very small crock pot ) about 10-15 mins. not letting the water reach 100 degree F /37.777 for you guys this is important d/t if you add nicotine in your mixes straight away the heat will start to degrade your nic. I tend to not put nicotine in it until it has steeped may be old fashion but that’s the way I mix.
Then after the heat steep I will mix it on a magnetic mixer. You could achieve the same result w/ an Ultra Sonic Cleaner make sure all your lids/caps are on tight for the USC you wouldn’t want any water getting in them.
Then I open the juice up to air exposing it and letting some of those " pefumey " notes dissipate for a little while could be 1-4 hours could be overnight depends how strong the note is. Then I stick it in my steeping drawer ( cool dark place ) and shake it every few days or at least when I can remember Most of all giving your mixes adequate time to steep but I read you certainly have done that. So my best advice is to get some better concentrates like FA ( Flavourart ) INW ( Inawera) , FLV ( Flavorah ) these will make a huge difference you’ll use way less and you’ll get more of a truer taste ! .
@Ken_O_Where Thanks for that. It sounds interesting and should only cost £15 for 10ml of each flavour. If I can’t find anything else on the recipe list I’ll have to give this one a go.
@GPC2012 I’m mixing 10ml bottles at the moment as not to be wasteful. I used a calculator to work out a 30/70 mix with a starting flavour percentage of 6% (PG 1.9ml, VG 7.9ml, Flv 0.6ml) and then increased the flavour percentage by 0.2ml until I got flavour. The downside was that as I mentioned above the flavour was either non-existent, or perfumey.
I’m steeping in a cuboard in my en-suite office which I temperature regulate due to my electronics in there. I steep for a minumum of 5 days before I test a ml or two, but as I don’t like the flavours I got some here that have been steeped for a good month. I’ve been giving them a shake daily and leaving the cap off for 15 minutes every other day. Steeping only seems to strengthen the fragrance rather than the taste.
@Josephine_van_Rijn I was actually just looking on justflavours247. They seem to be slightly cheaper than some others I was looking at so I’ll probably make that my next stop. I have to agree; I’m beginning to think the concentrates are just poor quality in general. They’re “supposedly” from FL, TFA etc but just re-bottled and branded by the third-party mixing kit so who actually knows… (It was makemyvape, btw)
@Rob62 Bookmarked, thanks for the link. I’ll have to check all these stores out.
@Amy2 Thanks for that. Seems the two recipes provided there would be ideal for me to start with. I am going to put this poor taste down to crap quality kit flavourings and try one of the above. I am currently using syringes but I did see some scales used in a video earlier and immediately wanted some.
Okay so it seems my best option right now is to get some scales, avoid kits, and follow @Alisa and @SthrnMixer recipes. I’ll put my current flavours down as just being poor quality (but keep) and buy the ingredients required for the two recipes above and see how that goes.
Hey @Lord_Dan I’m from the uk and here’s a few suppliers to get you going with some good nic,pg,vg and some good flavourings. http://www.flavourart.co.uk/
There are tons of excellent recipes by many great mixers. I’m honored to be counted among them, but I rate myself way, way lower than many others on here!
Hmmmm. Caps off for 15mins. Have you tried leaving the caps on?
I know there is an occasional debate on this topic.
My personal belief is that it lets the good stuff out. I personally do not air out any my mixes. They are exposed for a short period of time when I mix 12 recipies…but I half cap right after mixing a bottle and go to the next.
I believe this is because of the funny thing regarding oxidization. Air does that…allowing more air increase the speed of that factor while the rest of the magic needs more time. Factor 1 week you give it an extra 30 mins of air and 4 weeks you got 2 hours…that’s a lot of air.
The only time, for my belief, when needed to air out a mix is if the flavor concentrate is suspended in alcohol. Personally I mix with FA, cap, INW, tpa and not a single one do I air out. N
@Chrispdx I have yes. My first attempts I never bothered airing as I was unaware of it. It was only when I started to research the poor taste I saw airing mentioned and gave it a go to rule it out. Personally didn’t make much difference so I don’t bother with it much; at least not on my later attempts.
@SthrnMixer I’m giving it a go regardless The flavour I was thinking of was Element Emulsion’s “Keylime Cookie and Frost”. What’s the best additive for that cool feeling without the minty taste?
Koolada would work well for that cooling effect without the mint/mentholly flavor overpowering everything else.
The thing i notice about the flavor choices you have of those 6 is pretty much no supporting flavor. As was mentioned by @GPC2012 using a sour/citrus flavor works wonders to make fruits pop more, personally i use a few drops worth (like 0.25-0.5% range) lemon mix (inawera). You might do well to follow the advice of @Ken_O_Where and check out some of the more well rated recipes that fancy your taste and do an order of the most common flavors in them. Creams and bakery notes are great for trimming back and smoothing out harsher fruits, from there its just a matter of getting your ratios right for each. Luckily as you may already know, the flavor list on the recipe site has an average mix and single flavor usage, along with notes and common recipes that flavor is found it. I would recommend giving that a shot, as most of what you listed for current flavorings wont do well solo… I do love the rainbow sherbert to be honest but not solo, it works very well with some strawberry or other fruits and creams like vanilla bean ice cream or bavarian cream. As for sweeteners go such as Super Sweet (cap) or a cotton candy, they can mute flavors out after a good steep if used in too high a %, sucralose additives work well with just a couple drops, but once you jave a mix with a sweeter cream and supoorting flavors, you may find you wont use sweeteners as often anyway. Good luck and I hope at least somerhing I said was of some help. If you need any furtger help or advice feel free to ask, myself along with many many others here like to help anyway we can.
@Lord_Dan
One of the worst things you could have done…Mr Paddison, is to show up on this site. There are such good folks on here from all over the world, and several that live in your backyard. Trustworthy folks…mates…
So, you are already exposed to the best, whether you like it or not…no longer incognito.
If you hang with this forum, awaken to the abundance of tools offered on the recipe site, you will NOT be a newcomer for very long.
Some of the greatest contributors on this site are from your side of the pond…and some of the prettiest women are here on this side of the pond with the greatest mixes in the universe [not to discount the lovely Josephine from your side of the pond…she is a pure Darlin’ …check her out @Josephine_van_Rijn ]
All that said, there is more info here on ELR [forum and recipe site] than ANY WHERE ELSE IN THE WORLD
I hope you find it enjoyable, interesting, and informative…and that you find good reason to regularly participate [so we can check you out](just kiddin’) Welcome mate, I hope you stay active on here… cheers, and let me buy you a couple of cold jugs…
What Mike said I suppose. I’ve never went the Koolada route because I’m not a big fan of the menthol effect. I do have FLV Cool Menthol and have used it a couple of times, but to me it’s a distraction from flavor. Different strokes and all that
I have Koolada, but have yet to actually use it, I too am not the biggest fan of menthol or cooling effects in a vape, however I have 1 recipe I specifically require it… Cotton Candy & Popsicles. blue raspberry cotton candy and banana cream and orange FA with a little bit of Creme de Menthe for a creamsicle effect taste. So far is the only thing I have used anything menthol or cooling effect in successfully. I may try the recipe with the koolada in place of the creme de menthe to compare, I just think the creme de menthe fits the profile better since it comes equiped with a cream note
Also, oftentimes less is more with these flavors. Here’s what you can try. Mix up a 30/70 unflavored, 10mL bottle. Shake well, and then blend 50/50 with one of your yucky mixes (just do 1 or 2 mL). Shake well and vape. If it tastes better, that confirms your percentage is too high. If not, you can dilute it down a couple more times to be sure.
I think my biggest mistake starting out was my bad habit of using more flavoring than was needed.We are all trained like that.If 1 spoon of sugar is good then two would have to be better!
Like @Samsound mentioned when we use more flavoring than needed the taste will get muddled or muted but the perfume fragrance will definitely continue to rise.
Lots of good tips in this thread.Good luck and it won’t take long for you to get it all sorted!
Added a few additives to the shopping list then. I’ll probably give Koolada, Sours and Cotton Candy a go as I’m seeing it mentioned a lot in recipes.
It is true I did no research on the flavours when I started. I just picked the flavours I thought would be fairly nice solo, thinking solo flavours would be the best way to start; wrooong.
Soooooo, I should leave? [quote=“SthrnMixer, post:15, topic:75091”]
What Mike said I suppose. I’ve never went the Koolada route because I’m not a big fan of the menthol effect. I do have FLV Cool Menthol and have used it a couple of times, but to me it’s a distraction from flavor. Different strokes and all that
[/quote]
That can be true. But I notice Element seem to nail it. The keylime Cookie and Frost tastes exactly like Cookie Dough, but with a cool feel. Same with their Limon and Watermelon Chill. These are flavours I’ve never even liked before, but element grabbed me by the sweet tough and made me repent all other brands. I guess I can blame Element for enjoying the chill.
I’ll give that a go over the weekend and see what happens, thanks!
) and they’re usually not the best flavours.
Most of all giving your mixes adequate time to steep but I read you certainly have done that. So my best advice is to get some better concentrates like FA ( Flavourart ) INW ( Inawera) , FLV ( Flavorah ) these will make a huge difference you’ll use way less and you’ll get more of a truer taste ! .
The flavour I was thinking of was Element Emulsion’s “Keylime Cookie and Frost”. What’s the best additive for that cool feeling without the minty taste?
