why is it ok the clone a ejuice recipe ?? not exactly the same things but it is the same principle, i wonder how you feel about that ??
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This was just going through my head as well! Wonder if he mixes clone recipes!?
For that matter go to a grocery store. Thomas’ English muffins sell Thomas cinnamon raisin bread and so does Pepperidge farm. Who cloned who there!?
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I’d say its cool if its for personal consumption, but if a factory in China started selling clones of one of your recipes and making profit, I’d be against it. Especially if it were named and labeled like the original.
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so is it cool if a diy mixer clones a commercial juice and sells it ???
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In fact this has happened and the fallout was nuckin futs. Friends fought, friends were lost and everyone on the reddit subs ECR/DIY witnessed it, it was quite sad. Every once in awhile the argument is rehashed.
Besides not being any good at it this is one of the main reasons that i dont and wont clone a liquid.
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So i got curious about my little story and did some searching. The fella that cloned the liquids, there were two, is still in business while the company who’s liquid was cloned seems to be gone.
It was Grizzly Vapes Polar/Nanner Bear who’s liquid was cloned, the fella spent months and months cloning it, if i remember correctly.
In fact the fella, project_twenty5oh1, released the recipe to the public and a year or so later went into business selling it. He did sell small batches on reddit before he released it.
They are now sold as Prairie and Snowdrift and they are a couple of my favorites. Before anyone gets really angry about this the context is important, this falling out was harsh and it happened long before any sales of it, if i remember right.
Personally i feel if you work on something like that, put in that much time, money and energy the recipe is yours to sell. This is quite a bit different from cloned gear where you have a tangible object, IMO.
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Nooo, I guess I wasn’t thorough in my response. Nobody should be selling anybody else’s creations without an agreement with the creator.
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Tobacco, koolada, and menthol 
taste is subjective, i know the clone was not exactly the same as the original, but i don’t like it without tasting it
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recipes are different (imo). you cannot copyright a flavor
Furthermore I wish device cloners would use all high quality parts (grubs) and I would be more receptive to using one.
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good point
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very interesting.
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Haven’t read everybody else’s comments yet. But my take, this was more prevalent a couple years ago, when a good rda or rta was $50 - 100 bucks. Now top quality rdas can get for $20 - 30 there is no need to buy a clone.
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When I was targeting certain RTAs to fill out my vape stash, I had 2 main ones. The first was the Joytech Ego / Tron line. Love the rebuildable CLR coils. Since Joytech stopped making them and retailers started clearing them out at reduced prices, I was able to get originals at very good prices.
The 2nd RTA was the Kayfun Lite Plus V2. SvoëMesto’s price was $120.00. For an RTA? I don’t think so. I wanted 8 of them. I started doing some research on the clones and the EH Pro version got very good reviews. So, I ordered 8 of them at $9.95 each.
I felt a little dirty, but I took that $880.00 I saved, and rubbed it all over myself, and felt clean as a whistle again.
It turned out that SvoëMesto had discontinued the KFL+V2 anyway. It wouldn’t have made any difference in my decision though, if they still had them in stock. I understand a business has overhead and expenses, but so does my business, which is my family / household budget. I’m sure SvoëMesto didn’t scour the planet for the highest quality materials, regardless of price. They got the best deal they could, on materials that met their requirements, like any good business does.
I did the same thing.
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I’ve been thinking about the kayfun situation particularly since it came up earlier. This is where the “China factories stealing from Chinese factories and who cares” attitude really irks me. In this particular instance, we are talking about German Engineering. It’s one of the big things the Germans are known for. Beer and amazing engineering. When you want it, you pay for it. Like a Rolex. If you can’t afford a $10,000 watch, you should probably buy a Timex, not a knock-off Rolex. The knock-off won’t work like a Rolex, wont be made of the same metals and inner workings, only stands as a trick to fool people into thinking you can afford a $10,000 watch. Not the same thing as the kayfun, I know, but you get my point.
I won’t be supporting the knock-off industry. You guys and gals that are ok with it, I’m ok with you, I’m not the knock-off police! I just wanted more insight to help make up my mind and to understand how it works and you’ve all been very helpful and informative. Thanks!!
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I think people who look down on others who buy and use clones are uppity turds that should be over on ECF.
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When taking about clones, there is also another aspect which was highlighted by this thread After Delivery Fees? **ADVISORY!**.
If you buy an original item in another country / outside of the EU, you will get a ridiculous high extra bill if your package get checked in customs. Clones however are cheap enough that they fall under the “de minimis” limit with no import fees, VAT or import tax.
To make matters even worse, if you live in the EU and the product is not registered as a TPD compliant product, you also risk that it will be outright confiscated in customs. A chance you can afford to take with a cheap clone, but not something that you want to gamble with for a 100$ atty. And to make it even more worse, it is almost impossible to figure out which products are registered or not.
Ironically the legislation is encouraging us to buy clones instead of the originals!
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I hope I haven’t offended anybody. I thought I made it clear that I’m ok with everybody on this, not that anyone needs my approval! I opened this subject up when it finally dawned on me that there is this widely accepted practice of copying gear 1:1. And was trying to wrap my head around why it’s so accepted. We had a nice debate, and i made up my mind not to buy into the clone market. Everyone is cool here.
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I for one don’t think you were offensive at all. We all have different mores, ethics, and beliefs. A thread like gives most of us a way to express those aspects of ourselves in an amicable manner. The thread was a very interesting read for me and I appreciate it’s presence.
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Thank you!! I was expecting the torches and pitchforks any minute now 
I thought it was a pretty healthy hashing out of the topic, from all sides. I’m glad you appreciate it.
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Nothing wrong with sharing our different views and discussing matters in a civilized manner. I don’t think you have written anything anybody could reasonably be offended by.
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