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Real Tobacco (N.E.T.) Tasting Notes


#1

This post is for experienced pipe and cigar smokers to share their real tobacco experiences for informational use in NET blends.

Continuing the discussion from N.E.T ~ Latakia Blend:

[quote=“SthrnMixer, post:9, topic:29041, full:true”]
I hear you. Learning about pipe and cigar tobacco isn’t a quick process either. I know tons more about pipe tobacco than cigars though, so I’m listening as well. If you read my concerns about additives (casing/humectants) in many pipe tobaccos you’ll know that I’m thinking those should be avoided.

As for blending tobacco before NET - that’s interesting and certainly worth some thought. Here’s a thought for you. Burley tobacco has relatively little flavor compared to many others. In fact, straight up Burley added to most other tobaccos is hardly noticeable. It does impart kind of a nutty aroma, particulalrly off the smoldering ash. But one of it’s characteristics is how it will pick up the flavors of other tobaccos. If you were to put some Burley into some Cavendish, let it sit a while and then pick out the Burley and smoke it, it would taste like Cavendish. But Bing Crosby would argue with my assertion Burley has little flavor. His favorite blend was cubed Burley with Deer Tongue. Still, it does present an interesting thought. Whereas pipe tobacco companies such as McClelland’s, GL Pease, Solani have been blending tobaccos for generations, the uninitiated doesn’t really have that knowledge and expertise. For that reason then I agree you should probably NET individual types of tobaccos then mix them as independent components. However, if you can nail down some of the blended brands…as I’ve mentioned Reiner Long Golden Flake…or any number of great tobaccos that are just tobacco and no additives, then you get the benefit of their experience and success. Sounds like common sense to me. But which brands?

Assuming there are no additives and knowing there are none are two different things. I can certainly share blends I have had and believe to be pure tobacco, but I think the companies themselves are the only ones qualified to confirm their ingredients. That said, here are some of my favorites that I would say may be quite amazing NET products.

As already mentioned before, Reiner Long Golden Flake

As Va and Perique blends go, this one is a virtual tie with Reiner - Solani Virginia Flake with Perique

Rounding out the VA/P blends is Cornell & Diehl’s Bayou Morning Flake

My all time favorite, straight Virginia - McClelland’s #22

Each of these I’m nearly 100% certain are just tobacco. Here are a couple I wish I could mimic in an e-liquid that I know contain casings/additives.

These are all specacular in both taste and aroma…big time crowd pleasers. But it’s that last one, the Caledonian Highland Cream I would just die for. I only ever had it one time and then it became unavailable in the US.

I better wrap this up. Looks like once again I’ve taken a thread in the wrong direction :frowning:
[/quote]N.E.T ~ Latakia Blend


How to make your own flavors and nicotine?
#2

@SthrnMixer, here is a platform to share your experiences with tobacco. Hopefully others will share also. If I had something to offer I would, but as I relied earlier, my pipe/cigar experience is zilch.


#3

Sound good my friend. One more thing I want to point out. Aside from the pipe tobaccos with a strong flavoring component, most do not taste exactly as they smell in the tin once burning. In fact some that smell just kind of rank are ones very enjoyable t smoke. For example, when you open a tin of McClelland’s #22, you’re not smelling that glorious warm and nutty smoke smell that you get when puffing away on it. Nope. It smells like ketchup! Really! So another thought I’ve had is, well more of a question, how will the NET process make these taste like they do when they’re smoked? Interesting.


#4

From my understanding, some NETs take on a raw unburned tobacco flavor. Since there is no burning I’ll also have to learn how to mix in that effect.


#5

Perhaps some measure of toasting of the tobacco before extraction. That flavor has to come from somewhere…without flame!


#6

I’m not sure if this is fact. Once I have good tested extracts, then I will know where to go next. It does seem to have some merit considering I’m using tobacco leaf. My 1st ever extract tasted like what I use to smoke, so it may vary with tobacco types. I have 9 different types I’ll be extracting and it’ll be at least 2 months before I’ll have anything conclusive. I’m intrigued by the possibilities, but it will be a long process.


#7

I’ve only done one NET extraction so far. I can confirm the unburned tobacco flavor, as I reported in another thread. It’s a very good flavor, but not ‘the’ tobacco flavor that seems to be so elusive, in vaping. When I saw SthrnMixer’s comment about a measure of toasting, without flame, I couldn’t resist. What a perfect idea to try and release some of that elusive flavor. Anyone remember the Lucky Strike logo? ‘It’s toasted’.

I couldn’t take a chance, using our relatively new oven. That was tempting eternal wrath from my wife, should this science experiment go wrong. I got out an old but almost new condition (clean) toaster oven, that was stored in the basement. I evenly spread 15 grams of RYO tobacco out on some aluminum foil, and started a ‘light toast’ cycle, keeping an eye on the heating elements. Once they came on, I let it go for about 30 seconds, and shut it off, and let it cool down. I repeated that cycle 6 times. The tobacco was now crunchy. I was trying to stay below the combustion level of the tobacco. I kept a very close eye on it, while heating.

I then ground up the crunchy tobacco and covered it in PG, in a canning jar, and it’s now in the slow cooker bath. I’ll run it through 3 ten hour cycles on low, with a cool down between each cycle. The toasting may not make any difference, but at least I’ll be able to compare it to the untoasted batch I made a week ago, and see if the toasting helped to release some new flavor.

I’ll find out, in a week or so.


#8

I hope you’re on to something there! I’ve never heard of toasting before extraction, but hey, experimentation is often the key to making things possible! :blush:


#9

Well, it was mentioned by SthrnMixer, so I have to give credit where it’s due. It sounded like a great idea!

I have to issue a warning with this process. For those like myself, who have recently given up cigarettes. This is going to really test your resolve. I have not given a 2nd thought to cigs, since I started vaping seriously, 9 weeks ago. Vaping has satisfied my needs 110%. Not a single cig since.

I have to tell you, when the intoxicating aroma of that toasted tobacco filled the room…I heard voices. I haven’t been ‘tested’ like that in 9 weeks. Thankfully, my rig was charged, and the tank was full, with one of my DIY Desert Ship favorite mixes. Vape CPR. It got me past the urge. The aroma in the room has faded away, and I’m over the hump now.

To you tobacco loving, ex smokers…if you try this, be strong!


#10

Thank you @d_fabes I just know from all the pipe smoking I did for so many years that the most enjoyable aromas I had were never present in the unburned tobacoo, so it was just a thought and I’m glad to see you giving it a go.

Great advise and info. But as hard as I’ve tried to get my wife to vape, I’ve failed and she still smokes, so I’m around it all the time. I can probably handle some stoved virginia getting a good toasting…as long as I don’t have a piece of briar loaded up at the time.


#11

We’re in similar boats, Sthrn. I haven’t been able to get my wife to switch to vaping yet either. She’ll be a tough nut to crack, but I’m not giving up yet. I have to deal with her smoke too. That doesn’t test me, to be honest. After 2 months or so, away from the cigs myself, her smoke is kind of stinky to me, now. That toasting aroma is a whole different ball game. That smelled goooood…lol.

As to the toasted NET experiment, it just finished it’s last filtering stage, and is now in steep mode. It’s thicker, darker, and has a deeper ‘tobaccoey’ aroma, than the NET made from untoasted tobacco.

I wish I had thought to weigh the toasted batch, after toasting. Both batches were 15 grams, to start. I’m sure the toasted batch was lighter, after the toasting. Weighing it would have told me how much moisture was lost during the toasting. I do notice there is much less earthy mustiness to the aroma. Maybe that’s due to less chlorophyll? Just shooting in the dark, with that thought.

I guess the proof will be in the pudding, as they say, after a week or two of steeping.


#12

I’m excited at this news and so intrigued. Thanks a heap for trying this.


#13

So @d_fabes have you tried this yet? I’m interested in hearing your experience.

I did a N.E.T. but I’m really not at all happy with the taste. I used half a tin of tobacco and although I don’t think I need the other half to make another batch, I would be very interested in your thoughts on toasting it before extraction…just to see if it gives it that flavor you get from smoking a pipe. Otherwise I’ll have to take this experiment in a different direction entirely. My extraction came out dark and it’s very pungent, but just raw tobacco taste and I don’t like it.


#14

Sthrn, I wish I had better results to report, but unfortunately, that’s just not the case. I started the original batch of untoasted tobacco steeping on 9/9. The toasted batch started steeping on 9/21. They have basically leveled out at the same point. The toasted NET is darker, and started off with a deeper, more tobaccoey aroma. I had high hopes, that it was going to turn out much better than the untoasted NET. But that didn’t happen.

Right now, I don’t think I could tell them apart, with the taste test or the aroma / nose test. They both have that raw tobacco taste and aroma. It’s like the toasting didn’t change anything, in the end.

They can’t hold a candle, taste & enjoyment wise, to my regular Hangsen Desert Ship, TAB, #5, and Highway mixes.

While disappointing, in the end, it was still a fun experiment. I’ll still save my half pound of left over RYO tobacco, in case you manage to find a better process with your left overs. Right now, I’m at an impasse’ and not sure what to try next. Maybe Jim or Pro will have better results.


#15

Make sure you hang on to it. I’ve read of some tobaccos steeping for 3 to 6 months.


#16

Wow, I didn’t realize that. Thanks for that info. Perhaps it’s just still in it’s infancy. The toasted NET is only a week old. I think I may do some more filtering, also. I only used coffee filters. I read that coffee filters are 5 to 20 microns. I could order some 1 micron filter paper, and give that a try. Do you know if a vacuum set up would be necessary at 1 micron, or would gravity still be enough to pass the PG through the 1 micron paper?


#17

I did my filtering when my NET was suspended in PGA. It may filter slowly in PG.


#18

So, have you tried the toasted NET lately? Anything new to report?


#19

To be honest. I dumped it. The toasting really didn’t do anything for it, other than added a hint of a ‘toasted’ aroma. It ended up tasting just like the non toasted version, which was rather earthy and blah. There was some raw tobacco taste, but I wasn’t impressed at all.

I did six NETS since, using pipe tobacco, and they turned out much better. I extracted those with 151 proof Everclear. The 190 proof isn’t available here in Michigan. Those NETS turned out much better. The flavor is much brighter and potent. If I had to put a number on it, with a normal ‘mix’ being 0 and flavor concentrate being 100, I would put them at about a 60 - 70. Too strong to vape straight, but not quite flavor concentrate potency.

I combined all six of those extractions into one bottle. I ended up with just under 700 ml of NET. There really wasn’t enough of a flavor difference between them, to make it worthwhile keeping them separated in different bottles. I combined them and they have been steeping since 1/10/16.

I take a sample occasionally and play with it in mixes. It’s still an experiment in progress, figuring out how to best use it. I could reduce it with PG / VG to a recipe level strength, and use it as a tobacco base, and experiment with adding other flavors to it. Or, I could use it more like a flavoring, in smaller amounts, and add it to other mixes. I haven’t quite figured out the best way to go with it. Maybe some as a base, and some as a flavor additive.

It tastes pretty darn good. It’s also a bit of a coil gunker, even after vacuum filtering, with a 1.5 micron filter.

For the moment, I’m content to let it steep, and sample it occasionally. The whole NET thing is a learning process, and there’s really no hard & fast methods or rules. You try processes and see how they work out. That’s fun to me. It’s not an expensive proposition. The wife replaced her old slow cooker with a new one, and the old one works fine for this. I already had a bunch of Ball canning jars. Coffee filters are cheap. I fabricated a vacuum filtering set up, out of an old small, air compressor. So as I learn, it’s easy to apply what I learned, to the next batch. I have the junk needed, just add some Everclear and a decent tobacco, and try it again.

I want to try the next batch without grinding up the tobacco, before I add the PGA. I have a feeling that will make it cleaner, and reduce the coil gunking. While the grinding helped extract flavor, I think it also made it harder to filter. I want to give the last batch a couple more months of steeping, before I dive into the next one.

So, the verdict on the toasting is a thumbs down. Just didn’t add to the taste like I hoped it would. Sure smelled good toasting it though! Lol.