I hear over and over, “I prefer flavor over clouds”. I vape around .05 to .15 on a regular basis. On my way to vaping this low I went through various vape levels. I started like most you vaping at 1+ ohms. As I went lower and lower flavor got better and better… The clouds got thicker too. So when I hear "flavor over clouds’, it really puzzles me. It almost seem to imply that there is less flavor in a cloudy vape. I know where I vape now is much more flavorful than when I vaped at higher ohms. I recently tested a higher ohm… supposedly flavor build and it really sucked for me. I know it wasn’t as flavorful as my current vape.
What’s you thoughts and experience? If there is a way to get great flavor at higher ohms I’d like to try it. It would save me a lot of juice and battery life.
I am kinda with you. I think the better flavor builds I have done have ultimately produced bigger, denser clouds. I never understood it myself. I am a flavor chaser. I don’t like too warm of a vape. But not too cold either. Somewhere in the middle. I could care less if I make a cumulus cloud in my living room. As long as the flavor is there I am a happy camper. Kicked back in my recliner with my Gibson SG and a good flavorful vape… heaven man. Now where did my TV go? Ah there it is, behind that cloud.
My journey took me through various methods of turning liquid into vapor as well. But when most people say that about flavor over clouds, I kinda think it may be born from experiences such as you find with using the Atlantis tank or other toppers that do a great job of producing clouds but lousy on flavor. So for myself this statement of favoring flavor over clouds is quite true since I can relate to getting lots of mist with very little zip. Lately though, I’m getting plenty of both, and it’s a beautiful thing.
Excellent choice @Shaner. That’s my favorite set up… nothing compares imo. That setup really dispels the rumor that clouds are not flavorful. I could see where it may apply to kanthal… but Ti is the best of both worlds.
I suppose I look for that balance of both. Clouds without flavor…IMO, what’s the point? Flavor with no clouds isn’t the full vaping experience. My Mutation X produces massive clouds, but the flavor sucks compared to my Plume, Yep or Velocity. Needless to say the Mutation has been shelved for some time now. Waiting for a good stable TC mod in order to try my TI wire properly. Right now the closest I have is the M80 and while I love it with the SS wire, the TI is disappointing.
I would much rather have flavor over clouds. As I have gone through my vaping journey I have experienced that as @Pro_Vapes mentioned, the clouds come along with the flavor. I use my TFV4 with a .25 ohm SS dual build in it and it is wonderful. I kind of wish I had less clouds from it because I am forever setting off my smoke detector with the clouds! I think I want to try a lower ohm build the next time I rebuild my tank. I haven’t gone below .25 yet and I have yet to try Ti wire, but you best believe that as soon as I am able I will be doing just this! I can’t wait! All of the posts that I have read about lower ohms and Ti wire have me salivating for it!
The answer to this question for me anyway has nothing to do with big clouds not having flavor. It has to do with the fact my lungs are in fairly bad condition due to smoking so much for so long. So when I refer to Flavor -vs- Clouds I am saying I want good flavor but not a SUPER DENSE cloud to get there.
My journey in vaping has taken me from the cheap little starter kits on to the Kanger T3S tank with an istick 30 then to the Aspire Nautilus using the istick 30. At that point I started opening the airflow more and more and slowly converting over to direct lung hits instead of mouth to lung hits. I found that the vape was actually not as harsh that way. Next I got my first dripper setup. This was the Fat Man atty with a Sigelei 150. This setup had a dual coil build at .8ohms using 28 gauge kanthal wire. At the time that was the most flavorful vape I had ever had.
Now comes the issue with my lungs. After less than 2 days using this setup I was worse off than when I was still smoking cigarettes. My chest hurt I has having trouble breathing it sucked, I finally had flavor but it was killing me to enjoy it. I played with all kinds of builds and found my HAPPY SPOT with a single coil build running someplace between .9 ohms and 1.2 ohms again using Kanthal wire and a slightly restricted airflow.
I have since moved on to RTA,s as dripping was just not for me. I still use a Velocity dripper with a single coil .08 ohm ni200 build on my IPV4 for flavor testing but other than that it is a Lemo tank airflow wide open with .8 ohm kanthal single coil running someplace between 12 and 16 watts or a Lemo tank airflow wide open with a .08 omh ni200 single coil build on the IPV4 at 50 Jules and someplace between 300 and 400 degrees depending on the juice and my mood.
So for me anyway flavor -vs- clouds has nothing at all to do with clouds not having flavor but more to do with getting good flavor without the big dense clouds. I have vaped some very low ohm builds as my son is a true cloud chaser but I can only do 1 or 2 draws on his setups before the super dense clouds start to hurt my lungs. I say all of this having experienced both worlds. Don’t get me wrong the big dense clouds are satisfying but not if I have to hurt to enjoy them.
It’s a good thing we do not have to pick flavor or clouds. Of course I like flavor and enjoy blocking out the tv show with a cloud. Prefer a dripper (rda) to a tank. Have retired my share of rda’s for lack off flavor. For me now it is more of a question of how much heat do I want in my vape. Higher watts = more clouds and flavor = hotter vape.
Have you tried using SS wire? I’ve not ventured much into Ti and I don’t really do nickel even though I have spools of the stuff. So far, my favorite wire is 26 gauge 316L. I feel like it gives better, cleaner flavor than kanthal. You can build with it similarly and not get huge clouds but still get great flavor. Just a thought.
@JoJo No I have not tried SS or TI wire yet but it is on my to do list. I was thinking from everything I was reading that both possibly contributed to denser vapor not just better flavor. The denser vapor is what I want to avoid but from what you just wrote maybe I have been looking at this the wrong way.
I think a big part of it has to do with the way you build. I typically build single coils both in my subtank and my drippers. It doesn’t take much to get the coils I build to get hot. I typically get it around 0.4 ohms and I can fire it around 15w. I’m sure I’m not getting near the amount of cloudage that some would consider adequate…probably quite anemic compared to most, but I like it that way. Bonus, my batteries last longer since I’m not going much higher than 20w most of the time. Although, with the crown I’m at 25w since the stock coil is dual.
I know there are others around that can’t do or don’t like lung hits, sub ohming, and huge clouds. If you’re interested, search the forum for mouth to lung and you’ll probably find some good suggestions.
Ya very disappointed w that mutation took a few trials to get a decent coil in that thing. And still the flavor is no comparison to my dogev2. Luckily it was free from someone who was new to vaping and decided they didn’t like it’s flavor production. Don’t mind it sitting on the shelf since it does look nice.
I believe flavor over clouds is for the OTC juice. I have no clue I’m purely guessing here, but when you have the choice of 50/50 or 70/30 the 50/50 may be more intense with the extra pg…??.. I don’t think it applies the same as most of us tend to mix at what seems like 70/30 at a very minimum of VG
I use mtl mainly in the am because of the excessive smoking and at the moment I’m using a kayfun v4. The one i have seems to do ok. It serves my personal preference.
I also have an ubertoot clone on order and the kind folks on ELR put me right and once the consensus seemed to be the ubertoot I ordered. Will update my thoughts.
One thing i must add is i get very good flavour from my kayfun.
I’m on the ss wagon @jojo and i must agree, flavour is awesome compared to kanthal. It’s like night and day.
But jojo the same applies with the difference between ti and ss. You should try.
I have some new Ti and plan on it in the next few days. My first go round with Ti was less than satisfactory, but it was mostly user error (and a little bit of a non-TC, TC mod lol).
