nothing to do with parental guidance. If you’re seriously suggesting i should throw away my natural lemon extract, if i don’t want my lungs to suffer, then i want that discussion out there in it’s own thread, where i can read it at my leisure, not conflated with all this gubbins. But, what the heck, that’s a pretty big “if” methinks.
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At your (de-conflated) leisure, your non-parental guidance:
Jay, Lemons contain Citric Acid and some Ascorbic Acid (Vitamin C). Little or no Acetic Acid (in Vinegar).
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Thanks for the basic chemistry lesson, Mr Raven, Sir. But the the thing is, I could swear that you also mentioned citric acid as one of the substances that could react with palm oil (or residues of oil in palm-based glycerol, or something like that) , to grim effect?
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What is funny about all of that, when I stopped smoking and started vaping, my chronic bronchitis that I would get for years on end, went away. I have not had bronchitis in 9 years, coincidentally that is when I started vaping.
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Jay, I (above) reported reading that Palm Oil contains a fair amount of Tocopherol(s) (various molecules know collectively as Vitamin E), and wondered if perhaps (low quality) Glycerol (might, possibly) retain some of that. From there, Tocpherol(s) Acetate would be be formed in solution by the addition of (small) amounts of Acetic Acid. None of which likely has one nitty whit to do with the chemistry of your favorite “citrus fix” …
… but fear not, I have some cautionary tales regarding the (predominant?) Citric Acid of your Lemon Craze:
… starting at around temperatures of 150 Deg C, and more significantly at 175 Deg C, it dehydrates (losing Water), and decomposes into Aconitic Acid. There are two isomers of Aconitic Acid (AA) - trans-AA (having a melting point of 194-195 Deg C), and cis-AA (having a much lower melting point of 122 Deg C). This means (when vaporzation temperature is below 195 Deg C) that decomposed Citric Acid will result in little solid chunks of trans-AA floating around in one’s Nicotine salt e-juice. Sort of sounds like a bad idea ?
Aconitic Acid is sometimes utilized as a flavoring agent: trans-AA (“nut, vegetable, caramel”); Cis-AA (“wine acid”) - so one would expect a (Citric Acid formulated) salt of Nicotine to alter e-juice “flavor profiles” as a function of vaporization temperatures (when between the two differing melting points of 122 and 195 *C).
Higher temps may decompose Aconitic Acid to Methyl Maleic Anhydride (“not for flavor or fragrance use”).
Source: The Knightly Business Report: Potential Grim Effects File (Dec, 2018) … 
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That’s one of the acids that can be used in the making of nicotine salts. We were talking about the difference between and additive and something used properly in a process.
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Similar story here. Wheezing at night. Constant shortness of breath. Cold air would send me into convulsive coughing. Had an inhaler. All that is gone. My doc just says, you’re movin a lot of air now. Gooberment can’t control the illegal sales, and the other black market activities so they do the only thing they know how to do. Ban everything. It’s simply a way to save face. They can’t enforce a ban either. The problem will just become deeper. It’s what they do. Give it to the guberment and they will fuck it up regardless of what it is. Period.
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No point in arguing about side tracking /OTs we all do it at one time or another @jay210 Jay strictly talking could be right in starting a 3d on its own rather then side tracking this one.
That’s because i think that a conversation about compounds, acids, temperatures, warnings, effects is always interesting, if left here could be lost amidst the hundreds of posts, whether right or wrong I found it very interesting and worth going deeper on its own, the more we know, the better and we won’t have a smart asshole next week coming up with things like: did you know that cinnamon contains, lemon if, PG if and on and on, remember that we teach other people how to mix, I personally write articles on mixing and the more information to evaluate I get, the better, the healthier we make our vapes the better, at the end it’s a new field, we learn new things every each single day, none of us has “The Truth” .
I’m still wondering why some flavours/mixes scratch my wife’s throat tried all combos of Full PG, full VG, no DAAP, no sub-ohm, low or high nic, no butyric, flavours that are synthetic, natural, NET and on and on… this just shows that there are still a lot of things we have to learn.
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“I wonder if the “passionate” statements mentioned by the media, scientists and authorities will ever be corrected once the exact cause of this outbreak has been firmly established. I even wonder if the media will cover the story at that time with the same “passion” as they are doing today.” 
http://www.ecigarette-research.org/research/index.php/whats-new/2019/274-us-lung
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Probably on page 6
Oh yeah, ps: we might be wrong about this vaping thing.
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I myself would expect nothing substantive - only snooty dodges to hand-wringing “moral hazard” arguments.
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Politico really nails all the pernicious ass-clown festooned charlatan pols seeking to attack our Nicotine (and our ally Dr Michael Siegel is quoted therein, as he has been appearing quoted in numerous articles):
(September 14, 2019): “Trump responds to one vaping crisis by attacking another”
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RealClear Politics - Commentary written by a professor of medicine (also quoting Dr Michael Siegel):
(September 13, 2019): “Vaping Scare: Unhealthy Actions From Health Officials”
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These articles are making a lot of progress towards putting the truth and some rational information in the public eye. However, such clarity remains the (relatively hard for most folks to locate via internet searching) exception as compared to the (dominating in quantity, despite it being “noise”) rule that pervades the click-bait airwaves for cretins. Our society has forged it’s own fetters by accepting lies/corruptions as acceptable.
One can deny what has not yet happened to have “gored their own oxen” - but those same persons have no excuses for the dear costs to them of their very own apathy, if/when tyranny arrives on their own doorsteps.
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The broad masses of a population are more amenable to the appeal of rhetoric than to any other force. Words build bridges into unexplored regions. The leader of genius must have the ability to make different opponents appear as if they belonged to one category. The victor will never be asked if he told the truth.
What luck for rulers, that men do not think. What good fortune for governments that the people do not think. The great masses of the people will more easily fall victims to a big lie than to a small one. The efficacy of the truly national leader consists primarily in preventing the division of the attention of the people, and always in concentrating it on a single enemy. The great strength of the totalitarian state is that it forces those who fear it to imitate it.
-Adolf Hitler
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A tragic situation exists precisely when virtue does not triumph but when it is still felt that man is nobler than the forces which destroy him. We of the sinking middle class may sink without further struggles into the working class where we belong, and probably when we get there it will not be so dreadful as we feared, for, after all, we have nothing to lose. One of the effects of a safe and civilized life is an immense oversensitiveness which makes all the primary emotions somewhat disgusting. Generosity is as painful as meanness, gratitude as hateful as ingratitude. Progress and reaction have turned out to be swindles. Seemingly, there is nothing left but quietism - robbing reality of its terrors by simply submitting to it.
If thought corrupts language, language can also corrupt thought. Political language … is designed to make lies sound truthful and murder respectable, and to give an appearance of solidity to pure wind. Political chaos is connected with the decay of language … one can probably bring about some improvement by starting at the verbal end. Nationalism is power hunger tempered by self-deception. Who controls the past controls the future. Who controls the present controls the past. The nationalist not only does not disapprove of atrocities committed by his own side, he has a remarkable capacity for not even hearing about them.
Early in life I had noticed that no event is ever correctly reported in a newspaper. Advertising is the rattling of a stick inside a swill bucket. The great enemy of clear language is insincerity. When there is a gap between one’s real and one’s declared aims, one turns, as it were, instinctively to long words and exhausted idioms, like a cuttlefish squirting out ink. Doublethink means the power of holding two contradictory beliefs in one’s mind simultaneously, and accepting both of them. All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others.
The very concept of objective truth is fading out of the world. Lies will pass into history. Winston could not definitely remember a time when his country had not been at war. We have now sunk to a depth at which restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. But the thing that I saw in your face no power can disinherit: No bomb that ever burst shatters the crystal spirit.
In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act. If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear. I sometimes think that the price of liberty is not so much eternal vigilance as eternal dirt.
-George Orwell
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Nah, no political or monetary motivation.
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Yep… wishful thinking on my part. Even with the facts exposed the masses will still choose to believe the original reports. Sad …just sad.
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Sooo, if there would be a ban on the flavors, i guess it means only tobacco flavors would be allowed…
Would the PG/VG base and/or the pure concentrates also be banned?
If not, prepare to get loadz of new members 
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If you check the stock markets for tobacco companies, you’ll see what is expected… I think there will be a little increase in users here but I’m not convinced most vapers will turn to DIY.
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Your probably right, its a proces of trial and error.
Tough you would have kind of shake and vape concentrates, just add the PG/VG Base in there and your set 
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I had a ray of hope yesterday. Did a show with I’m guessing 400 folks in the audience. Very interactive audience. I vaped on stage as per usual, and not a pod. Not a word. No signs of anyone distancing themselves from the “evil vapor”. Even had a gooberment official presenting an award. She kept a sock in it.
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Well, after the miasma of the Agitprop Woodstock State Livestock Fair, Michigan style, it is nice to know that (so far) only an incremental approach is current dictata regarding enfarcement of MCLA 330.1281a (1)(a) pursuant to the ritual practice canons set forth in MCLA 330.1281b. Circumstantial pharmakoi was the original mode of “healing therapy”. Human as well as animal sacrifice. Governance by divined exclusion. Sticking with approved staples of Baccy, Booze, Broiled Beef, and Open Carry Bazookas is duly sanctified. Basil, Balsamic, Baguettes, Broccoli, Beets, Bamboo, Bilberries, Breadfruit, or Biotics - dangerous heresy.
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