Guide to Complicating Things - Formula for predicting flavor in RTAs

This will be a long post so if you don’t read the whole thing I completely understand.

I feel like there is a formula for discovering flavor capabilities of all these new subohm RTA’s out there. I feel like deck and chamber size as well as chimney size and length heavily influence flavor production capabilities. Do these variables represent all there is to it? No, of course not. You also have to take into consideration coil build, distance of coil from air intake. Dimension of air intake. Power used. The list goes on and on. But it is my feeling that those type things considered equal, the flavor production of any tank can be estimated by the deck and chimney. Then again that presents a different problem. How does one rate flavor?

What brought me to this thought is how I’m lying in bed today…very uncharacteristic of me on a Saturday during the college football season. I’m sitting here with 5 tanks, and mentally noting their flavor production. For the purpose of meaningful discussion, let’s go ahead and give flavor some defining terms. Let’s rate it from 1-5, with 1 being the lowest, 5 being the greatest. Here are my impressions

5’s. I’m getting kick ass flavor from 2 tanks. The Goblin Mini is best, but right up on it’s heels the Joyetech Delta II.
4’s. The TFV4 with dual rba. and the Joyetech eGo One Mega
3 The Kanger Subtank Mini

No 1 or 2 flavor tanks in my lineup today. But the question occurred to me…why am I getting the difference between these tanks? The average person may get that glazed look in their eyes, view me with complete disbelief and think duh, they’re different tanks. Yeah I know, but what is it about them that makes flavor so different? After all, on the Delta and Subtank I have the exact same build - 22ga Ti, 5 wraps, 2.5mm. Can’t be the coil. I’m running them the same temperature. Vapor production is basically the same. There has to be something making flavor so different. I mean it’s the same set up but the Delta is killing the Subtank on flavor. Similarly, I have dual coil builds on the Goblin Mini and TFV4, but the Goblin stomps the Smok’s rearend. So what is it? You may recall me saying my vape with the TFV4 is the most enjoyable I’ve had. That is true, but it includes more than just flavor - also vapor volume and vapor temperature.

Before I go further, let me define the parts as I interpret them.
The deck - the part where you attach the coils you build.
The chamber - the part that encases the deck
The chimney - the part that connects the chamber to the top of the tank

So what are the differences or similarities in these tanks that produce greater flavor or lesser flavor? Let’s compare them with simple observation - no calipers or slide rules just yet.

The Delta. The RBA deck on this is similar to the Subtank Mini. It’s more like a rebuildable atty. However unlike the Subtank where a narrower chimney screws into it, when you put the Delta back together after inserting the RBA into the base, the entire RBA section actually slides inside the chimney. In other words the chimney has a larger diameter than the chamber. The Goblin, on the other hand, has a fairly small chamber compared to most subohm RTA decks. It’s chimney section diameter is about 1/3 the diameter of the chamber.

The TFV4 and eGo One Mega I put in second place, but that’s not to say they don’t have great flavor production. They really do…excellent in fact. But the other two do edge them out a bit. The difference between these tanks is night and day, although identical in setup to their #1 counterparts in that the eGo One Mega RBA is like a rebuilt coil that inserts into a chimney similar to the Delta while the TF-R2 RBA deck is like a regular atty that the chimney screws into like the Goblin Mini.

The Subtank Mini RBA is also like a rebuilt stock coil in the way it is designed (round instead of square though).

With all this in mind, I’m starting to wonder what role deck and chimney size has to play, as well as relative distance from the coil to the drip tip. I feel it is largely responsible.

So the Delta chimney is basically a tube the RBA slides into when it is put together. There is only a slight reduction in diameter from the bottom of the chimney (retains about 3/4 the size) to the top, and that reduction is for maybe 1/2 inch.

The Goblin Mini’s chimney is approx 1/3 the diameter of the chamber. It’s length is slightly less than half the height of the chamber. That reduction in diameter between the chamber and drip tip connector is not further reduced when using the stock glass drip tip.

The TFV4’s chimney isa little more than half the diameter of the chamber. It’s length is roughly the same as the chamber height.

The eGo One, like the delta, has the barrel type chimney that doesn’t get reduced except for the drip tip.

And lastly the Subtank mini chimney is a bit less than 1/3 the diameter of the chamber and approx the same length as the chamber height.

So how can this information be helpful to estimating flavor production with tanks you haven’t tried yet? Well that’s what I’m asking the community as I’m not totally sure. I do know beyond a doubt that something causes more or less flavor production. It’s not all coils, deck/chimney dims, distance to drip tip from coils, power, air flow etc but rather a combination of these things. My point is that I suspect the design from deck to drip tip have an enormous impact on flavor. I kinda feel like this has become something I assess about a tank on a subconscious level, which could explain why I jumped to purchase the Ohmega after @quitter1 posted a photo last night. I’m fully expecting this to have killer flavor due to the design, but we’ll find out.

Still here? Wow! Got any insight into all this or am I full of crap?. I would really like other’s take on this and if you think flavor production can be predicted with any measure of accuracy just by looking at a RTA. Oh and while I have never owned a Lemo, I almost bought a Lemo Drop when they first came out due to the shorter chimney. I suspected it might have better flavor production. I wonder if that’s right. I could look up video reviews I know, but I take those with a grain of salt, especially considering you can find ones that say the Atlantis gives great flavor.


IDK, it is a good question. I’ve heard a lot of people say that the lemo had such great flavour because they adopted the kayfun style chimney. With the lemo 2 they let go of that and I’ve heard the flavour on that one is not so good. I have the first lemo and the lemo drop and they are amongst my favourite tanks. The TFV4 is a great tank for flavour and clouds and has the same narrowness at the top of the chimney as the lemo, although it is shorter. Personally I’m not a fan of wide-open chimneys and drip tips cause I do think they are not performing as well in the flavour department. (I’m probably getting bashed for this :grinning:) but that is just my personal opinion. I won’t call it MHO because there is nothing humble about my opinion but with those things I just feel like I’m sucking in way too much air and get less flavour.
I won’t be surprised if this topic will come up with a lot of different views and opinions like you get when it comes down to rating flavours. Nice way to spend a saturday though :relaxed:


I think the Delta II is a beautiful tank, but I don’t enjoy it so much. I WANT to.enjoy it.
I have a .5 build on it and normally vape at 30w. Flavor is just not there.

Also, I have an aspire Triton. I love the design. Especially love the top-fill part of it.
Again though, I haven’t found that I can enjoy this tank either yet. Have a .6 build
and vape at 30w. Again, flavor is just not on par with my Troll.

I drip all day long on my Troll and it’s build is just a .8 ohm clapton. I vape
normally at 35w. This is really great flavor producing to me.

But, I WANT to use a tank when I leave the house. Not sure what to do
to change these tanks to my liking.


When I was using Kanthal coils (stock or RBA) I was at 45 watts. Kick ass flavor there. I modified my RBA section to wick more juice and am currently running it with 5 wraps 22ga Ti in TC. Awesome flavor. I wonder if the lack of flavor for you is due to running at 30 watts? I never was happy with it below 40 myself.


If you are talking about the TFV4 with this statement I totally agree. The only way to get a hit out of that tank is to push major wattage and literally burn a ton a juice to compensate for the massive air flow. I could like the TFV4 a lot more if I could actually control the air flow. You just can not tone down the air near enough for those that don’t care for that much air…


I’ve got a CLT Infinite 1:1 clone that has crazy good flavor. I suspect a big part of it is the way the chamber and chimney meet almost seamlessly and has a smooth funnel/cone shape that concentrates your vapor as it comes thru the tip. The other big factors seem to be a clever airflow design and a relatively small chamber size. But with tanks it’s really hard to say. So many of them seem so similar it must be voodoo that makes the flavor so different!


It doesn’t produce so well with kanthal but it rocks with 28g 316L. I’m sure it kicks butt with TI but I don’t have a TC mod so my TI roll sits unused.


Airflow for me on the TVF4 is usually one way or the other depending on my mood. If I’m in the mood for some deep. satisfying hits then it’s wide open. Typically in that case I’m updwards of 500F or maybe a bit higher. More often tho I have it only about a third of the way open. Still good air flow but at cooler running temp and consequently less juice consumption, I still get a good draw that is flavorful. At 1/3 open, the Goblin Mini has about equal aiir flow wide open. And this is a good segway to getting the discussion back on track :slight_smile:

Why would the Goblin Mini give me more flavor? Aside from the obvious difference in size, there are numerous differences between these two tanks. One difference I think may be key is the distance the vapor travels once it is produced until it leaves the drip tip. This is around 1 inch. Contrast that with the TFV4 with dual RBA, there it is twice that distance. What else? The Goblin mini deck is slightly smaller in diameter than the TF-R2. However, it’s chamber is shorter.To me it reasons that either the shorter distanc the vapor has to travel, or the narrowing of the chimney, or a combination of the two is the reason for such a difference in flavor production.


In all honesty the best flavour tanks I own are the ones that have small chambers and narrow chimneys and a little more restricted air flows . I also haven’t seen this mentioned but I find the drip tip plays a huge part of the flavour . I hate a wide bore drip tip and especially hate the secondary airflow on those drip tips . I put a thin drip tip about the diameter of a analog on the tfv4 and it improved the taste quite a bit . My idea of a great tank is one that is efficient . It extracts the most amount of flavour and vapour out of the least amount of liquid. The tfv4 uses about 5 ml in an hour with the quad coil and has great flavour but I get the same or better flavour from my ubertoot v2 or taifun GT v2 so i consider them better all around .


I’m sure you do, you got to. I do not like it hot. I like my vape around 450 degrees max. I’m also willing to bet you lung hit. I can not due to COPD. Try doing a mouth to lung hit at 450 degrees and see if you can get anything out of it with a TFV4. As I said the TFV4 for me is entirely too much air even with the vents closed to a pin hole. I fill my mouth with air then wonder where’s the vapor. Not my cup of tea @SthrnMixer. I have no problem with others thoughts of the TFV4. Their situation is different than mine and they do not have my limitations. So there you go, my story in a nutshell. I smoked entirely too long and now I suffer for it…


With the TFV4 - absolutely. In fact I would say that should be on the box…designed for lung hits only. Likewise the Nautilus, Kayfun, Aerotank…those should say MTL (Mouth To Lung). It’s just how they’re designed to operate optimally. I for one can vape either way though, and in fact did run through a couple tanks on my Nautilus mini today while lounging in my bed, typing away at you guys :smile:


I can totally agree with that. Perhaps if it had I would not have had to waste my time and money and could have sold it to someone who would be raving about it as you guys do. At least I can say I have learned the ways of the TFV4 and of course this is a good thing when you are selling them…

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I don’t have a TC mod either.

I believe, as you do, the smaller the distance for the vapor to travel and more enclosed the chimney area, the better the flavor of the vape. Introduce too much air flow and flavor goes to shit. :wink:

On my Goblin mini right now is a single coil set up. It’s 28ga SS 316L, single wire 10 wrap micro coil and reading 1.2 ohms. I’m vaping this with the airflow at 3/4 open and at 13.5 watts (4.2 volts). I’m still able to do a lung hit and the flavor is phenominal!

The Goblin mini is a flavor hound! :sunglasses:

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Yep, that is true. I have to say that at this moment it comes in handy because I have made so many recipes over the last months that my cupboard is overflowing and I didn’t seem to make a dent in it with other tanks. I ran out of empty bottles and space to store, so I’m using the TFV4 to clear out some space and empty some bottles so I can make some other recipes while I’m waiting for some more bottles to arrive in the post.

[quote=“MixedUp1, post:9, topic:33262”]
I hate a wide bore drip tip
[/quote]I’m with you there!


Finally getting some good feedback. So far I’m picking up on a recurring theme - reduction in bore from the chamber to the mouth produces more flavor. Distance from the point of attack to the mouth also produced more flavor.

Exploring the first concept, it makes sense that there is a reduction in chimney size which forces vapor concentration. I think this may account for the liquid that forms in a lot of devices and comes out the drip tip. This is especially true with that Goblin Mini. It will reform into liquid all the way up to to the tip. I pull my drip tip every time I refill the tank and it’s always wet. Perhaps this concentration of vapor is why this tank has such great flavor. Makes sense. In that case the collection of liquid in the drip tip is an annoyance you deal with to get monster flavor. Other tanks are known for this too. But simple reduction of size alone obviously doesn’t create that flavor regardless of other variables. Airflow probably plays a big part, but chimney length likely does too. I find this all fascinating.

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Just as in juice flavors, tank are subjective and the only real point of view is your own. Some of what’s been stated here I don’t agree with and some I do. The only true formula is what works for you.

The latest example that comes to mind is the UD Bellus. Some say it has good flavor but I see it differently. The TFV4 IMO is the best tank on the market and some say it’s the worst. One of these tanks fit my vape style and the other one don’t.

It’s all about preference and how it fits in your style of vape. There could never be a formula to judge a tank because every vaper will view their experience differently. If there was a tank that fits all needs we would be vaping the same tank. Someone would have figured that out by now.

I agree with you, but I’m not really talking about preferences. In my original post you’ll see my thought is there seems to be things in the design of the tank that lends itself to good flavor. My quest is to discover what sets tanks apart (specifically RTAs) or what makes them similar regarding flavor production.Learning this would make it easier to look at a tank and get an idea if it would be good for flavor or maybe not so good.

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Good things (i.e. flavor) come in small packages! :wink: I’ve found this to be true not only in tanks, but drippers as well. The smaller the chamber, the more flavorful the vape…for my tastes.

I guess I’m saying if you prefer an airy tank over restricted air. It could have certain features describe as key but if the flow or whatever isn’t to your preference you may rule it out visually.