Mixing / Adjusting for strong flavor

E-liquids Beginners
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Hi all.

I’m been vaping for almost 7 years. Back in the day, pre-made juice was almost non-existent and poorly made. So I made my own. After much experimentation, I got tired of the trial and error and settled on a single-flavor Capella Vanilla Custard V1. I vaped this for years on 510s and then Kanger tanks, most recently the ProTank 3. All was fine because I wasn’t much worried about taste, just vaping with conveniency.

I’ve only recently jumped into the sub-ohm world and pre-made juices. It’s nice that I can taste good pre-made juices now, but I’ve found that I can barely taste most flavors, only the very strong ones. (This is not Vaper’s Tongue or lack of water - it’s a sinus issue, and I go through the same thing with food or drink.) In the past month I’ve purchased 40+ bottles of juice, and have found only 6 that I can really taste. Out of those 6, I’d only buy 3 of them again.

So I’ve decided to get into DIY. I found a half-dozen recipes here, ordered all the flavoring, and I already have everything else I need for DIY.

I want to make strong flavors. My gut instinct is to take a recipe and adjust it to double the flavoring and then adjust the PG/VG/Nic to end up with a double-strength 70/30 mix at 3mg.

Is this OK?
Is there a better way? Note that I do not have the patience to make a recipe, wait for steeping, try it, adjust, wait, etc, etc. I am much more inclined to make 4 small bottles with differing levels of flavor. It’s OK if I throw 3 of them away. Or 4. :slight_smile:

Also, are there any flavors that tend to be stronger than others? I have seen some charts around here listing “base percentages” for many flavors (for example http://vapingunderground.com/threads/flavorart-single-flavor-percentages.977/). I’m assuming that a flavor listed as 2% is much stronger than a flavor listed at 10%. Is that correct?

Lastly, does anyone have any suggested recipes with good, strong flavors? Sweet, sour, fruit, bakery, whatever. Right now I’ll vape anything that I can taste - though I’m not into using cinnamon, capsaicin or menthol.

Many thanks in advance!

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@ozo and @Pro_Vapes and @Amy2 you guys should jump in on this thread, you guys know more then I and have passed on some of your diy knowledge to me (believe it or not :wink:) and I think you guys could help here as well.

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@Scott_Steeves - A higher PG will enhance flavors. I wouldn’t go the route of trying to get your flavoring percentages really high, though, since high flavoring % can actually mute the flavor, as counter-intuitive as that might sound. At too high a %, a really good flavor can start to taste like chemicals.

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Go to my page and skim through my recipes on there, they are definitely flavor recipes that I can taste with the simular nasal issue as you.

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You said no menthol, but what about mints like peppermint, etc?

I have allergies that can cause the same problems you describe, but I have found that mints and a little sweetener will produce a good satisfying vape even when all else fails. They are also very easy to experiment with and fine-tune for your taste.

If mint is OK, I can point you to a couple of recipes to try.

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I agree with this statement! More is not always better especially when it comes to diy ejuice.

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A good sweetener can also enhance flavors. I highly recommend Liquid Stevia by Pyure. Do not use it over 0.25% because past that it will take over and be too sweet!

New_Liquid_Drops_RGB_1024x1024.jpg779×1024 171 KB

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Holy cow! I didn’t expect so much help so fast!

@MarkM - yes I know about VG reducing flavor. From the premade juices I’ve tried it seems that 70% VG produces the hit I like. I will try lower though. And “high flavoring % can actually mute the flavor” is definitely counter-intuitive. Would it make sense to make 3 bottles as follows:

  1. 1x flavoring (Exactly as the recipe states)
  2. 1.5x the flavoring
  3. 2x the flavoring
    ?

@Code-Vape - I will check your recipes and Stevia, thanks

@wonner1 - Mints are OK - as is cinnamon - in small doses. It’s a preference, not an allergy. I just don’t want to add menthol/capsaicin just to get something to taste, which is a recommendation I’ve seen many times in my research. Mint or cinnamon in the recipe is fine. Mint or cinnamon AS the recipe is another thing.

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Here is one to get you started. A darn fine vape with strong flavors and easily adjustable flavor strength.

http://e-liquid-recipes.com/recipe/642952/Mint+Mojito

PA. If you don’t have or want to use PGA (pure grain alcohol) or vodka, substitute water.

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Trial and error is the only way to find out what works for you. What works for anyone else is irrelevant.

That said, I suspect 2x flavoring is going to be WAY too much. Something more along the lines of 1x, 1.2x, and 1.4x seems a bit more reasonable to me.

And if you need to get more specific you can split off a 50/50 blend of the 1x with the 1.2x to effectively test 1.1x strength, etc. You could really nail down your preference without a ton of work.

This might be simpler to do if you have a decent standalone flavor to play with, instead of a multi-flavor recipe, but do what ya want. :wink:

I didn’t see anyone respond to this, but that is absolutely correct. If the consensus is that a flavoring makes a good standalone at 2% and another works well at 10%, then it’s reasonable to say the first flavoring is 5x as strong as the other.

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Well I have some Everclear, but neither of the flavors. :frowning: I will give it a try after my next order. Thanks.

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Thanks zigz! Good info.

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I agree with the previous statements. Try the oringial and work your way up. Some of the recpies posted are close to the high mark of flavoring already. But again this is based on personal flavoring preferances.

I know someone from another site that swears by a super high percent of shisha strawberry INW. Her recomeded percent works really really well for her, but it would not work for me. And wouldn’t work for most people. But you may fall in the same boat…go for it.

Just remember…it’s easier to add more flavor to a mix recpie/bottle of ejuice than it is to take away. The biggest cause for concern is missing your sweet spot. The other concern is not just completely doubling a recpie…rather you may need to double to main flavor profile but on increase the others by just a mere 0.25%.

You will also need to read up on the different levels of concentrates if you want to be successful right away. For instance, you may be able to double a cap flavor but an FA flavor you may only need to increase by just a bit like 0.25-0.75

The other part is to play around with the settings on your mod. Low temp, med temp, high temp. For me to hit my flavor mark I end up on a hotter vape than most people. But it’s a me thing and that’s were I personally find the best vape and flavor.

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If you do a high percentage of flavor you may notice in your ejuice calculator you aren’t adding PG for 70/30, it’s being added in your flavorings/nic. As everyone has already said doubling your flavor won’t double your taste. It has more to do with your taste receptors being “colorblind”. I think if you stick with the flavors you can taste you don’t have to increase much at all

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Tell us what those 3 are. Otherwise we’re just guessing. If they are not commercial juices, tell us what they tasted like.

Another option, if you have local Vape stores, is go do some free tasting. If you find some things you like, buy it in small bottles. It will be a valuable guidepost as you figure out how to mix to you taste.

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I am a high flavor % mixer because I was raised on rich, bold tasting foods that my mom used to make…That Cap Vanilla Custard you mentioned, I mix at 40/60 PG/VG with 10mg/ml nicotine for Mouth to Lung vaping…I mix it at 20%…then steep it for 6 weeks…Awesome, bold flavor… FA Forest Fruit…same PG/VG ratios, etc and I mix it at 12% to 15% and steep it for 3 weeks…Awesome, bold Flavor…Flavorah Wild Melon…Same base specs…mix at 9% and steep it for 10 days to 2 weeks…Awesome, bold flavor…all with NO Chemical taste, whatsoever…You may also find, that many of the Premium pre-made juices carry total flavor %s in the low to mid 20% ranges…pretty high…We could help you better if you shared what brand flavors you are using and the specific flavors…There are a host of recommended flavor % threads on Reddit, Here, Vaping Underground…’

What I do is work with StandAlone (single flavor) flavors to start…primarily fruits…mix little 7ml bottles at 5%…10%…15%…20%…steep them minimum of 2 weeks and try…mainly with fruits…Creams/custards take me longer…I avoided multiflavor, complex recipes until I was able to determine my flavor percentages in Single flavor mixes only…

I found it beneficial to research what the overall various strengths of the Major flavor companies were and here is part of what I found from strongest to weakest…(For Me)

MF (Medicine Flower) starting %s 1% to 3%
FA, Inawera, Flavorah starting %s 6% to 12%
Capella starting %s 12% to 20%
Flavor West starting %s 15% to 20%
TFA starting %s 15% to 20%
these %s are primarily for basic fruits…creams and other blenders usually are less, but i used fruits to get a feel for how the flavors worked for me and they are not carved in stone, but you will find that many people mix at these percentages AND you will find that many people think I am CRAZY… :slight_smile: …Taste is a very subjective thing, and you will hear that alot in this community

The key is to keep an open mind, practice good mixing routines and steep flavors…

The woman @Chrispdx referred to uses an Inawera Shisha Strawberry in her signature recipe at 15.6% in a recipe that she totals out at 30% total flavoring…AND at 84% PG… a bit much PG for me though…but she doesn’t steep her mix…however, it does change over time with her cream blends within the recipe…

Sometimes throwing caution into the wind is an excellent, fun approach to get some good shit… :slight_smile:…and I find that steeping liquids for a minimum of 2 to 3 weeks is essential for my mixing, especially at the %s that I use…

You mentioned that you were getting into sub-ohming…depending on your equipment, that should allow for lower flavor %s, however, you gotta start somewhere, and I experienced that the best way to find my sweet spot in terms of flavor %s was to visit the extremes and whittle them down from there…

You will find a plethora of opinions, experiences and information from some cool people on this site, as I have…

Welcome to the world of DIY mixing…by the way…what are your flavors (brand and flavor) that you are working with?

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A few on my notes. Just started out and am in a similar situation.

I also can’t taste squat. There has been only a few flavors that have gotten my tastebuds zinging so to say.

Enter the dragon by Phillip rocke. Stuff drives me wild. It’s like a desert. And some off brand vista vapors blueberry and also strawberry.

So I got into this trying to come close to the taste of the enter the dragon. And have learned a ton in a fairly short time.

Many have mentioned, over doing flavors will sometimes mute them. This is true.

Your on the right track, I’d say make 3 20ml of varying strengths. Most like 10ml but if you get a good one, it’s nice to have a few tanks of it, for as cheap as they are with diy.

Steep. Taste after mix. Then put away for a week, taste daily (personal choice). Most don’t have the patience, but trust me, it makes a difference. Plus this is helpful if you hit on something you like, when you mix up 5x 100ml bottles you will know what it tastes like stored for a bit.

Mix on a scale. You want varied percentages, that are kind of close to each other. Measuring by milliliter will not get you close to the accuaracy of what your looking for.

Keep notes. Whatever methods best. You notes will be a lifesaver more than once.

Sometimes brands and also flavors will vary in concentrated strength. So sometimes a little equals same flavor strength as two times another flavor.

Overall fruits and creamy fruits have been the best for me taste wise.

Good luck. And there are allot of helpful people and info here. Feel free to ask anything.

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Also, in my last enter the dragon blend, I feel like I’m semi close, and I am at a total flavor percent of about 26% total of all four flavors. I started low and worked my way up, varying approx 6 20ml.

One last thing. I’ve found every batch I’ve made vapable, some were okay to start, then it’s just been getting better. I like the last mix I made so much I did four 100ml bottles.

There is a learning curve, but if you research and more research, it will make it easier with better results off the get go.

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Could try: Check cookies
95% folks here probably think this is way too strong. Might try it. All of my recipes are on the strong side and not for general tastes. Hence, I only have bothered listing two.
If you try it and like it, PM me and can send requested flavor/category recipe(s).Bakery/deserts ok but no fruits.

Not a good idea. Each flavor pretty much has it’s max. strength in a mix. Too many variables (what mix with, base flavor and projected percent maximum attainable/practical, flavor supplier the lists goes on.) to even come up with a rule of thumb.

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@Chrispdx - Great point about it being easier to add flavoring rather than take it away.

And the point about doubling a CAP flavor but not an FA flavor is very disconcerting. Great point, and I appreciate the info. But it depresses me.

I have been playing with the mods & tanks and coils and coil types and settings. But that’s a whole `nother discussion… :slight_smile:

@BoDarc - “I think if you stick with the flavors you can taste you don’t have to increase much at all.” Great point and one I had pondered and then totally forgot about. Some of the recipes I flagged here are clones of the flavors I like, so it wasn’t totally forgotten.

@wonner1 - My 2 favorite are TNT by Time Bomb and Go Nuts by Vape Orenda. I actually don’t consider the Go Nuts to be strong but it is just strong enough and freaking delicious.

Backup flavors are Joker by Time Bomb and Enter The Dragon by Gemini (Philip Rocke). I’m not yet convinced about EtD, but it is strong enough.

I also have 2 that are actually too strong. Desert Sun by unknown, and Fresh Squeeze by Elements (I think). I actually have to dilute these.

I definitely prefer stores that allow tasting, or at least smelling of open bottles.

@Flavor_Alchemist. Some good points to keep in mind. Thanks. I grabed a few complex recipes that I want to try, but I also have plans on playing with single-flavor trials of my own making, for the reasons you mention. As for brands, I ended up grabbing whatever would make me those specific recipes I found. I have no real preferences yet - though my long-ago DIY work makes me prefer Capella and avoid LorAnn. In reality though, I’ll grab the brands specified by the recipe until I gain enough knowledge to make my own decisions.

@dieboy - Enter The Dragon is one I have and like, though I’m not totally convinced that I’d get it again. I would strongly suggest TNT by Time Bomb, which is similar - but IMHO a little less sweet, a little less strong, a little more peach, and the flaoring is definitely more natural IMHO. Or something. There’s just something about EtD that throws me off a bit.

I strongly agree about the scale and notes and patience.

@Brotherbob1, Belgian went into my favorites to make when I get all the flavors. Thanks

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