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Diketones, Oils, Sugars, GMO – All-in-one page: FA, TPA, FLV, CAP, FW, LB, etc


#183

PART II

(i had to split the post due to space limitation).
Less and no transparent companies below. All the info about the most transparent companies is in the main post - see PART I.
 
 

CAP – Capella

:blush: Capella Flavor Drops use no Sugar, Splenda, Saccharine, Aspartame, Caffeine, Sodium, Potassium Sorbate or Animal ingredients of any kind.
:blush: They provide DAAP testing results for most of their flavors in an easy-to-read format, but…
:rage: …their provide very limited DAAP information for their v1 flavors
:rage: You may want to avoid Super Sweet - more info here
:no_mouth: They say ‘We do not use Diacetyl in ANY of our flavorings’.

cap

Info about their diketone-free flavors is here

You can check higher amounts of ingredients in their v1 flavors here (including Butyric Acid and other). Bad news is that they released only information they had to due to legal reasons and not as an information for their customers. (hiding levels of ingredients below 10.000ppm for example; absolutely no information about Acetoin levels in any of their v1 flavorings). It is a bad practice and not very customer friendly, but still better than dozens of other manufacturers who are hiding all the information (why not releasing the DAAP information in an easy-to-read format for customers like they did for their v2 flavors???)

 

DEL – Delosi (Nicotine Labs)

:blush: They don’t add Sweeteners, Colors, Stabilizers or Preservatives.
:blush: There is an information about A/AP on their NicotineLabs website…
:rage: … but there is ZERO information about diketones on the official Delosi website
:no_mouth: None of their flavors have added Diacetyl.
:no_mouth: Only seven of their flavors contain A/AP (and they say they are in process of removing A/AP from these remaining 7 flavors)
:rage: No testing reports, no info about what their Not Detected (ND) limit was

Find more info at nicotinelabs.com or delosi.com
 

FW – Flavor West

:blush: They don’t hide levels of A/AP in their flavors
:blush: They provide additional info about other ingredients in their flavors, such as Triacetin, Ethanol, artificial coloring
:no_mouth: They don’t use diacetyl anymore (based on independent lab testings)
:no_mouth: High levels of Acetoin in some flavors
:rage: Bad reputation for lying about diacetyl in their flavors a few years ago
:rage: They use syrup and sugars in many of their flavors (more info here)

My opinion: Other flavor companies use questionable ingredients yet do not get near the heat that Flavor West does. Regardless of the past, after FW published their reports and changed their flavors i could say i trust them more than companies, who don’t release any info about their flavors publicly.

Listed are ONLY flavours with more than 10,000 ppm (>1%) of Acetoin.

You can find more info about flavorings with diketones here.
 

OSDIY – One Stop Flavors

:rage: Flavors were analysed only for D & AP, but not for Acetoin
:rage: Their lab test reports are 3 years old.

osdiy

Note: Shown are only flavors with more than 100 ppm of D/AP.

More info is here.
 

PUR Purilum

:no_mouth: All Purilum flavors are DAAP-free
:rage: No lab reports + no DAAP information on their own website
:blush: A member of AEMSA

 

FR Flavor Revolution

:no_mouth: All their flavors are DAAP free
:rage: No lab reports and no their own website.

 

INW - Inawera

:no_mouth: Some flavors contain A and some flavors contain AP.
:rage: No testing reports provided on their not frequently updated website
:rage: No helpful information on their website about ingredients used, coloring, sweeteners, etc.
:rage: One of the most popular companies SHOULD BE more transparent and customer friendly!

inw
Note: There might be other flavors that contain A and/or AP. You can find SDS of some most popular flavors on NicotineRiver.

 

HS - Hangsen

:no_mouth: All Hangsen flavors are D-AP free
:rage: No testing reports provided on their website
:blush: Huge. More than 1000 employees worldwide. 1000+ flavors. More than 4 mio bottles produced every month and a lot of testings…
:rage: …but sadly, while probably great for business partners, they are one of the worst examples of non-transparent companies for customers.

Other flavors such as French Vanilla Ice Cream or Australian Chocolate don’t contain DAAP.

 

AL - AtmosLab

:no_mouth: They say their flavors do not contain any D/AP…
:rage: …but they don’t provide any lab test reports on their website and no information about Acetoin is found.
:blush: Their eliquids, bases and flavours that do not contain any allergens and are gluten free, sugar free, GMO free and Nitrosamine-free.
:blush: Their Tobacco e-liquids are Pesticides free.
:blush: They work closely with Toxicology Labs of Medical School in University of Thessaly and Crete and they regularly perform toxicological analysis that go far beyond standard examination (TSNA, PAH, heavy metals, pesticides).
:blush: They use only the purest raw materials, far beyond pharma grade purity: VG (99.9%), PG (99.7%) and nicotine (99.9%)

Atmos Lab is the first ecig manufacturer in the world performed Chemical Analysis for Pesticides’ Residue in Eliquids with Tobacco flavours and all their Tobacco Flavoured Eliquids are Pesticides free.
 

NV - NicVape

:no_mouth: They say their e-liquid flavors are D-AP free.
:rage: No information about Acetoin in their flavors
:blush: Customers have an access to NicTrace™, a lot/batch number tracking system, where they can view view all lab analysis and testing results (CoA) from an independent (third-party) certified laboratory.

More info on their website.
 

LA – LorAnn (Lauren)

:blush: They provide information which flavorings contain nut and dairy allergens
:no_mouth: No public reports yet, but they say they are not adding any Diacetyl to their flavors
:rage: Several flavors contain oils, which are very bad for vaping.
:rage: Several flavors contain artificial colorings, which are best to avoid.

Be sure to check this table (note: it’s not LorAnn’s official and several flavors are missing here).
 

GLF - Great Lakes Flavour

:no_mouth: No Diacetyl in their flavours
:rage: No information about Acetoin
:rage: Very limited info about AP in their flavors can be found here.

gls
Note: lab test results of some flavours are missing (Vanilla Swirl, Sugar Cookie, Sweet Cream)

Canadian company. Their website is here.

 

DV – Decadent Vapours

:no_mouth: NO Diacetyl and NO Acetyl Propionyl in any of their 150+ flavors
:rage: NO information about Acetoin in their flavors

More info on their website.

Note: They had their lab test reports shown on their website, but they removed them (Aug 2017). I assume they are preparing new transparent information about DAAP levels in their flavors for their customers.
 

GS – Get Sucred

:no_mouth: Their flavors do not contain any Diacetyl.
:blush: They say which flavors contain A and AP.
:blush: They provide information which flavors are artificial and which are natural.
:rage: They don’t provide any numbers and lab test reports.
 


 

:-1: The following companies you should avoid if you care about diketones. :-1:

They didn’t release any public report about diketones in their flavors, they either refuse giving any info or they say they will provide any MSDS sheets on a flavor if you email them (which is absolutely not enough; somehow i would rather see them publicly commit themselves with those reports, which they want to send me; also MSDS sheets often don’t give any information at all about DAAP levels).

:rage: . BF – Baker Flavors
:rage: . CC – Chef’s Choice
:rage: . CdD – Club der Dampfen
:rage: . CCW – CupCake World
:rage: . DIYFS – DIY Flavor Shack
:rage: . FE – Flavors Express
:rage: . GF – German Flavors
:rage: . HGD – Hangda
:rage: . JF – Jungle Flavors
:rage: . MF – Medicine Flower (Lotus Flavors)
:rage: . M&P – Mom and Pop’s
:rage: . NF – Nature’s Flavors
:rage: . SA – Solub Arome
:rage: . SAS – Sasami
:rage: . VT – Vape Train Australia
:rage: . VW - Vape Wild
:rage: . VZ – Vaping Zone
:rage: . WF – Wonder Flavours
 


#184

Update

  • Purilum (PUR): Lab test reports found; info updated
  • Inawera (INW): Lab test reports found; info updated
  • Hangsen (HS): Lab test reports found; info updated
     
  • Nicotine River (NR): Newly added
  • VaporFi (VF): Newly added
     
  • Real Flavors (RF): levels of DAAP in their flavorings updated
  • Flavor Revolution (FR): info updated
     
  • FULL reports info added: for the most transparent companies; extensive information about chemicals used in their flavorings (not just DAAP info); extremely helpful info about possible allergens for many vapers
  • The main table updated and the main post split on two parts due to the limitation

#186

Im super confused after reading this thread. I was expecting answers, not more questions…


#187

What do you mean Laura5? Primarily it is about how transparent companies are about ingredients in their flavorings to their customers, so vapers can find the information they need, all in one place. It may me useful for:

  • those who want to avoid flavors that contain diketones
  • those who want to avoid Butyric Acid
  • those allergic to some chemicals
  • those who want to avoid certain chemicals, sugars, sweeteners, artificial coloring, etc

These vapers can’t find these information sorted in one place; if there is any other or better source, then please let me know.

But it’s not just them. The info here is also useful for basically any vaper, including professionals, who are looking for the information about specific flavors, searching for specific chemicals which they like or hate, or for example finding out what cream is muting their flavor - all those can find these info at one place now, with links provided (i’m not sure if many vapers knew there are full lab reports, just like for TPA in past, available for several other companies now, like Hangsen, INW, RF. I know many experienced vapers were searching those tpa info occasionally in the past).

But you’re right; this thread could be much more useful and interesting for many. Please help me with any advise about how to make this thread less confusing, more informational and overall better. You can also send me a PM. Thx for your reply.


#188

This is more of a healthy debate thread, took me a while to get through. There is good info here, but the title is misleading, only because there is primarily debating about transparency and other such things. No offense or ill feelings meant to you or anyone


#189

Thx Laura. :grinning:

I agree with the title; it could be more precise about transparency thing. I chose this title to be more visible for those are searching these kind of information (it sounds better than “A study about how transparent vaping companies are?” - who would be opening that, right?). Besides, the inside info is what’s important and that’s exactly about what title says and that’s what vapers are searching. Still, if you have any idea how to make the thread better (or anyone else), then please share it. Let’s make it better and more useful.


#190

@Mikser Your efforts are very much appreciated. Question: what are the acceptable ppm for home and industrial settings. Is anything with <5000ppm AP “safe” according to our regulators or do they put the limit as <1000. I understand it all depends on what percentage of a flavoring you put in your recipe, I’m wonder where the ceiling should be set if the FDA decides to ban certain flavors. Perhaps they can limit the DAAP ppm in commercial ejuice without banning any specific flavors.


#191

Has a statement by their flavours

Arôme de qualité alimentaire adapté à la vapote, 0% sucre 0% diacétyl 0% colorant

Food grade flavouring suitable for vaping, 0% sugar, diacetyl, colouring


#192

Thx @MRA. Sorry for late reply.

It depends who you ask. Pro-diketone group is surely not concerned of any levels, diketone concerned wants to limit the level of diketones and some wants to avoid them completely. Note that there is no scentific research showing that vaping diketones is harmful (it’s just a speculation that they might not be very healthy based on indirect evidences).

Regulators don’t limit the level of diketones (yet); it is purely companies decision to make their flavors without DAAP (i’d say because of commercial reasons, but probably also to avoid any claims later if diketones are proved to be harmful someday). Personally, i am using many flavors with diketones and hardly any of my mixes is DAAP free. Overall i’m much more concerned about oils, sugars, syrups, aspartame, artificial flavoring, GMO in my flavorings.

Imo DAAP levels are just an appropriate excuse to limit vaping. FDA is under huge pressure of mighty pharma and tobacco lobbies; ofc they don’t want you quit smoking and they are so powerful that can dictate the rules (see EU legislation and numerous other countries).

What it can happen is they might try to ban D-AP in flavorings (like UK did, but it is not enforced thankfully) or overall ban of flavored liquids (like they banned flavored cigarettes). If this happens some flavors of some companies will be banned, but not many since most manufacturers are producing flavorings we vape for other uses (food; levels of DAAP are not important there and D-AP is completely safe to ingest; it means vaping D-AP flavorings will still be possible; see MF, NF, FA, LA for example). FDA won’t ban those and we will be able to buy them for our purposes. Third option is they could ban selling / importing e-cigarettes or ban vaping overall (like Thailand), which is unlikely since that would be a totally fascistic regulation.


#193

Thx @SuperFrog. I intentionally left mentioning Diacetyl-only in the table since the large majority of companies don’t use it at all. For transparency the manufacturer should list at least D+AP levels in their flavorings, so concerned vapers can avoid diketones (AP is very similar to D and many manufacturers use AP a lot).


#194

You’re right. Here is an example:
FLV Coconut flavor contains 2800 ppm of Acetoin (highest level of all FLV flavorings). So, when you use 1% Coconut in your solo mix (average quantity is up to 1% since FLV Coconut is super concentrated), that means 2800 ppm x 0.01 = 28 ppm (which is 0.0028%) in your liquid.

TPA Coconut Extra is a different animal. TPA testing report says <10% (up to 100,000 ppm) of Acetoin in this flavor. TPA flavors are not concetrated, the average quantity by ELR users is 3.9% and the result is 3,900ppm of Acetoin in your solo mix (139 times more of Acetoin than in our Coconut FLV mix above).

Ofc, in recipes you have to add levels of DAAP of each flavoring to get the approximate level in your mix. Several top rated recipes at ELR contain over 4000ppm of Acetoin for example (that much of Acetoin is uncommon for commercial juices these days).


#195

Compare: Flavors with the highest levels of D-A-AP

 

all6
all7


#196

Was looking for D-A-AP information on VT (Vape Train Australia) and stumbled upon your thread. Good job! Glad to see you pursued this transparency topic and were not dissuaded by the enthusiasts.

For now will be avoiding VT like the plague.

Again, thank you for your hard work.


#197

Btw, you might want to start a GL (Great Lakes) entry. Be interested in their transparency efforts. They have a Butter flavor that is gaining popularity. They also have R1 and R2 flavors (seemingly equivalent to V1 vs V2),


#198

A little confused as to why Kais Virgin Vapors is in this thread… Do they now manufacture their own flavors? Afaik theyre an eliquid maker only…?

Btw, good work. Didnt mean to only show up to criticize


#199

Thx @iVapeDIY. I really appreciate it. I will add an information about Great Lakes Flavour soon.

Thx @netweight. You’re right there. I will delete Kai’s VV in my next update (long time ago i had an idea to include some popular manufacturers of finished eliquids, but you’re right there; it’s just more confusing). Thx for paying attention on this (and let me know if there are other confusing entries; i appreciate it).


#200

Update

 

Great Lakes Flavour (GLF) added. (thx @iVapeDIY)
Vincent Dans Les Vapes (VDLV) added
CirKus (CKus) added
Vape Wild (VW) added

VaporFi removed
Vape Organics removed
Kai’s Virgin Vapor removed (thx @netweight)


#201

Thanks for this updated info.
One of the vendors i use for flavours had the FA premium custard and FA whipped cream but they dont provide info on the products.
I like to know what im buying!! :slight_smile:


#202

MY INTERPRETATION OF MANY STUDIES I HAVE READ OR INTERVIEWS SEEN THIS LAST PERIOD:

MOST USEFUL IS: The July 3 Data Dump from the UK National Statistics showed that over the last 10 years prescription NRT have lost 75% of their sales and 65% of their income (price increase I guess) while during the same period of time vaping rose to 5.5% (?) and smoking declined to 15.5%… lowest ever. Also 1st time vapers (never smoked anything before) total 0.4% of the industry.

Yes Big Pharma is unhappy. But I think the people who have tried their ‘successful’ tool (if you make 5+ attempts to be quit) will disagree and side with the 50+% successful former smokers who did so with Gen 2 & 3 devices.

If the Lost Vape rumor about a pod kit with an evolve chip including RePlay comes to market they will have achieved something the FDA values in a standardized and approved cessation or harm reduction device… a simple one button option that delivers a given quantity of the special ingredient in a consistent manner. RePlay ("basic’) will only be offering the identical taste from pull to pull. Power and ingredients won’t change.

Length of pull time is the single variable left to set and in NYS they choose 5 seconds for medical marijuana. This will likely be closer to the stand we will see available soon on starter devices.

Things like this are what IQOS could not provide with enough harm reduction to get that seal of approval. BT won’t release much more than we have seen with GUSTO until they can go full barrels blazing on something that is finally (like NRT’s) not consider a tobacco product. (WHY? NICOTINE IS NICOTINE… SUE THEM FOR 'UNKNOWN or Small Business MANUFACTURER BIAS DISCRIMINATION REGARDING E-LIQUID).

Don’t take this as gospel, just my understanding of an overly research topic that the UK is leap years ahead in life saving preventative measures. Our Former CDC head honcho should be charged with conspiracy to kill any tobacco related deaths that could have been prevented on her watch if she didn’t care about her japanese Tobacco Stock Portfolio and any impact the effects of vaping growth in the US marketplace might have on their consumers who are offered less (IQOS 83% less harmful via toast not burn)