20-22 people linked to health related vaping problems:

Just damn sad… is all… really sad :cry:

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It is as much intended as humor as anything - but the reader must click on the link above for the punch line.

This “breaking news” article puts new a twist on and gives a new meaning to the saying “Katy, bar the door!”:
Vaping fears prompt Alabama high school to remove bathroom stall doors

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You gotta love corrupt organizations like CDC and WHO that knowingly want to spread misinformation about vaping

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and to think… reps from the cdc has to be present in some labs to inspect the flavors being made…
For Vaping… :slight_smile:

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URINE TESTS !!! indeed not heard one case of this simple method… :shushing_face:

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This looks like interesting information (indicating that certain Vitamin E Acetate additions were intentional):

(Leafly; September 6, 2019): “Vape Cart Additive Makers Pull Products as Others Go Dark

Clear Cut contains vitamin E acetate. Jones confirmed in a letter to Leafly that Clear Cut contained tocopheryl-acetate. Jones wrote Leafly that he had permission to use it from the Oregon Liquor Control Commission and thought it was safe. … The popular illicit market diluent thickener Honey Cut, based out of Los Angeles, may contain vitamin E oil, according to independent tests …

.

(Leafly; September 9, 2019): “Vape Pen Lung Disease Has Insiders Eyeing Misuse of New Additives

Industry insiders who track the legal and illegal vape cart markets closely tell Leafly that a new type of additive started showing up in late 2018, and has since become widely used in underground markets. It’s a novel class of odorless, tasteless thickening agents. These liquids come in different proprietary formulations manufactured by both legal, above-board companies and by shadowy underground operations. This new additive may or may not play a role in the current health crisis. But it is one of the major new ingredients in illegal vape cart oil in widespread use this summer.

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I do believe so too…

have a read

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For the curious (regarding Vitamin E related substances, and Acetate Salts):

(Leafly; September 11, 2019): “Amid Vape Pen Lung Disease Deaths: What Exactly Is Vitamin E Oil?

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oh, come on. as you pointed out yourself, glycerol and PG are also on the list.

Maybe you guys guys can start your own quiet little thread about the dangers of putting acetic acid or citric acic in your juice?. I’d be seriously seriously intersted to know if there’s any real concern here, given that some of us do talk of adding vinegar, lemon . or commercial “sour”" to our juice.

Suspect you’re just taking the piss, in fact. But you’re so freaking deadpan it’s hard to be sure.

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Hi Jay, Harlan and I were having a rational discussion there - no parental guidance needed or desired. :thinking:

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nothing to do with parental guidance. If you’re seriously suggesting i should throw away my natural lemon extract, if i don’t want my lungs to suffer, then i want that discussion out there in it’s own thread, where i can read it at my leisure, not conflated with all this gubbins. But, what the heck, that’s a pretty big “if” methinks.

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At your (de-conflated) leisure, your non-parental guidance:

Jay, Lemons contain Citric Acid and some Ascorbic Acid (Vitamin C). Little or no Acetic Acid (in Vinegar).

:stuck_out_tongue:

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Thanks for the basic chemistry lesson, Mr Raven, Sir. But the the thing is, I could swear that you also mentioned citric acid as one of the substances that could react with palm oil (or residues of oil in palm-based glycerol, or something like that) , to grim effect?

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What is funny about all of that, when I stopped smoking and started vaping, my chronic bronchitis that I would get for years on end, went away. I have not had bronchitis in 9 years, coincidentally that is when I started vaping.

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Jay, I (above) reported reading that Palm Oil contains a fair amount of Tocopherol(s) (various molecules know collectively as Vitamin E), and wondered if perhaps (low quality) Glycerol (might, possibly) retain some of that. From there, Tocpherol(s) Acetate would be be formed in solution by the addition of (small) amounts of Acetic Acid. None of which likely has one nitty whit to do with the chemistry of your favorite “citrus fix” …

… but fear not, I have some cautionary tales regarding the (predominant?) Citric Acid of your Lemon Craze:

… starting at around temperatures of 150 Deg C, and more significantly at 175 Deg C, it dehydrates (losing Water), and decomposes into Aconitic Acid. There are two isomers of Aconitic Acid (AA) - trans-AA (having a melting point of 194-195 Deg C), and cis-AA (having a much lower melting point of 122 Deg C). This means (when vaporzation temperature is below 195 Deg C) that decomposed Citric Acid will result in little solid chunks of trans-AA floating around in one’s Nicotine salt e-juice. Sort of sounds like a bad idea ?

Aconitic Acid is sometimes utilized as a flavoring agent: trans-AA (“nut, vegetable, caramel”); Cis-AA (“wine acid”) - so one would expect a (Citric Acid formulated) salt of Nicotine to alter e-juice “flavor profiles” as a function of vaporization temperatures (when between the two differing melting points of 122 and 195 *C).

Higher temps may decompose Aconitic Acid to Methyl Maleic Anhydride (“not for flavor or fragrance use”).

Source: The Knightly Business Report: Potential Grim Effects File (Dec, 2018):nerd_face:

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That’s one of the acids that can be used in the making of nicotine salts. We were talking about the difference between and additive and something used properly in a process.

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Similar story here. Wheezing at night. Constant shortness of breath. Cold air would send me into convulsive coughing. Had an inhaler. All that is gone. My doc just says, you’re movin a lot of air now. Gooberment can’t control the illegal sales, and the other black market activities so they do the only thing they know how to do. Ban everything. It’s simply a way to save face. They can’t enforce a ban either. The problem will just become deeper. It’s what they do. Give it to the guberment and they will fuck it up regardless of what it is. Period.

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No point in arguing about side tracking /OTs we all do it at one time or another @jay210 Jay strictly talking could be right in starting a 3d on its own rather then side tracking this one.
That’s because i think that a conversation about compounds, acids, temperatures, warnings, effects is always interesting, if left here could be lost amidst the hundreds of posts, whether right or wrong I found it very interesting and worth going deeper on its own, the more we know, the better and we won’t have a smart asshole next week coming up with things like: did you know that cinnamon contains, lemon if, PG if and on and on, remember that we teach other people how to mix, I personally write articles on mixing and the more information to evaluate I get, the better, the healthier we make our vapes the better, at the end it’s a new field, we learn new things every each single day, none of us has “The Truth” .
I’m still wondering why some flavours/mixes scratch my wife’s throat tried all combos of Full PG, full VG, no DAAP, no sub-ohm, low or high nic, no butyric, flavours that are synthetic, natural, NET and on and on… this just shows that there are still a lot of things we have to learn.

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“I wonder if the “passionate” statements mentioned by the media, scientists and authorities will ever be corrected once the exact cause of this outbreak has been firmly established. I even wonder if the media will cover the story at that time with the same “passion” as they are doing today.” :thinking:

http://www.ecigarette-research.org/research/index.php/whats-new/2019/274-us-lung

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