Flavor warnings help
There are a lot of posts floating around about this topic already, but my opinion is none of them. I want to know they’re there, but I don’t sweat it. I was inhaling way worse stuff smoking and I had no intention of quitting then. Harm reduction…I’m not pretending that e-liquid is perfectly safe, but it’s a lot safer than what I was doing and I’m happy to continue doing what I’m doing. There’s no hard, fast evidence either way when it comes to this stuff and not enough research has been done. For those who choose to avoid, more power to them. For those who don’t, that’s their choice as well.
Personally I’m not worried about any of em. I’ve been smoking 4000+ chemicals with my tobacco for 44 years so i’m not really loosing any sleep over a trace amount of something or other in my vape. Most vendors have or are in the process of removing the offending additives and now you have people looking for the flavour with the additive because apparently they taste better. I think it is a personal choice, they are easy to avoid if you don’t want them. I wasn’t planning on living forever and God knows what I inhale just walking the street, so I just enjoy my vape.
The majority of the flavoring companies out there have removed diacetyl or claim to be diacetyl free. I do not believe there has been actual proof that inhalation of this is actually harmful BUT take the whole popcorn lung thing for example where workers who inhaled powdered diacetyl for years developed this condition…proof or not this is enough information for me to stay away.
Something that I find interesting and a lot of people do not know this is diacetyl is actually in cigarettes! Levels of diacetyl in tobacco are significantly higher than those found in the factories where the popcorn lung was contracted, bringing into question is the diacetyl the cause of the condition?
Unfortunately there really hasn’t been any major testing in the vape world on what is really harmful or not and we may never know for many years.
As for me, I prefer to try and stay away from anything that has a lot of controversy around it to begin with
I will warn you…this topic is a “rabbit hole” from which many never return!
You just beat me to it
I agree with @Jimk…this is a topic with NO END or resolve my friend…
what is more frowned upon, diacetyl or acetone?
Anything custard related is “frowned upon” I believe… which would be both…
Personally inhaling anything besides good ol’ oxygen really isn’t “safe” for you…but good lord anything is miles better then all the shit they cram into an analog cigarette…
Acetone is the stuff in nail polish removers. Acetoin (which is what you’re thinking of, I’m guessing) is supposedly LESS harmful, but nobody really knows for sure. It’s the same type of chemical, just a step prior to diacetyl. According to TPA, It’s been shown that acetoin can ‘catalyze’ into diacetyl naturally so even if there isn’t any added diacetyl in something, a flavoring that contains acetoin (and also some natural flavorings that are extracted from fruits) can also contain trace amounts of diacetyl.
Basically, if you’re wanting to avoid diacetyl, you’ll probably need to avoid all ‘diketones’—diacetyl, acetoin, and acetyl propionyl.
You will go completely mental in a search for your answer on this and at the end of the day…no avail
Mt baker has a blog about Diacetyl if you are interested
but like I said nothing to my knowledge has been proven as fact yet so jump on down that rabbit hole if you wish…I did! Took me about a week to climb back out and I’m none the wiser;)
I am a custard/cream lover when it comes to ejuice and I like popcorn…win win right?
I have two concerns… flavor and value. When I see a car coming I get out of the street. The same with vaping. If I knew there was something to avoid then I would avoid it. I enjoy vaping too much to fear the unknown. Anybody who think they control their own destiny is a fool. You may be able to cheat a lot of things… but death isn’t one of them. I heard a saying as a young man that taught me to live in the moment. It is “As sure as you were born to die.” I learned then not fear the unknown. There are too many ways to leave this earth than to be so concerned about one. Live for today because tomorrow ain’t promised. I’m gonna get down off my soap box now and mute this post.
Signing off… NewDrip aka ND aka Vape Happy!
Is there a vendor that is Diacetyl free? Or is there links for Diacetyl free recipes on here?
From what I know, most flavor vendors are trying to be “diacetyl free” but a lot of them use acetoin and/or acetyl propionyl as an alternative. If you check on a flavor in ELR, it will let you know if there’s a known issue with a flavor by displaying a little triangle, or you can check on the vendor’s website. Your best bet would probably be to stick with Flavour Art flavorings for the most part as I believe they are supposed to be free of diketones, or find flavors that are known to be clear of acetoin or acetyl propionyl. But, if you want any kind of authentic cream, milk, butter, custard, etc. flavor it is going to have either diacetyl, acetoin, acetyl propionyl, or butyric acid (another alternative to diacetyl).
You’re a Saint!
Mother Theresa’s got nothing on you! ; )
Every Vendor has made a effort to go Diacetyl Free. Why I have no idea but they have. I don’t know how many times I have said this already on ELR, guess I’ll say it again. NO ONE has proven that Diacetyl is bad for you while vaping since our exposure is next to nil. The only PROVEN fact is the workers in popcorn factories have developed POPCORN LUNG from the diacetyl exposure that in one day is more then you will vape in a year. Know this, if they do not use diacetyl then they have to use a substitute. Those substitutes are Butyric Acid and Acetoin. It has not been proven that Acetoin is any better for you then Diacetyl. It is also not proven that Butyric Acid is better for you than Diacetyl, in fact there are those who believe it is worse. As @NewDrip believes, I believe. As I tell my wife, let’s not worry until we have something to worry about. I see nothing here to worry about…
TFA claims that Acetoin is not a Diketone. Guess it’s not…
Man, I can beleive That…
Nothing to talk about here, Agreed…
I stand by this thought…
Hence the quotes around diketones. It technically isn’t a diketone, but is lumped in with them so often that it’s easier just to call them all diketones. TPA calls them ‘custard notes’ which I guess works as well.